Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

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Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Sat May 17, 2008 11:08 pm

Agosto 31:

El Colorado and some turns at La Parva


Different day with the same morning routine. The only difference was that I needed to get all my gear out of the room. Unfortunately it’s pretty hard to find stuff when the roommates from the lower bunk has scattered her stuff next to the bed and all over my own stuff. Had to sort through her pants, shirt and bra to find a missing sock.
:oops: :oops: :oops:

The Bellavista Camp transportation to the ski areas was with a bus today, not a van. I guess that the demand is greater on Fridays and weekends. Another difference was the delays in leaving Santiago. It wasn’t until 8:30am that people were done renting skis and clothes and were ready to leave. The next delay was at the “mandatory” stop at the convenience store. Driver mentioned 5-10 minutes, unfortunately some people are never in a hurry. :( To make matters worse, once back on the road and climbing up to the mountains, traffic was backup because a tracker-trailer. Fortunately the driver was aggressive and we eventually were able to takeover the twenty cars and the van in-front of us.

Everyone on the bus were going to Valle Nevado, except for myself. :D The driver had told me in Santiago, or tried to tell me that he was going to dropped me off in Farellones instead of El Colorado and continue on to Valle Nevado. I wasn’t going to frustrate passengers on the bus by having to wait after me, so I was getting ready and putting my boots in the last few shape curve on that road. Once the bus stopped, I was ready got my skis and left everything in the bus. See here you at 5:30!!! I don’t think the driver was 100% sure I understood.
Attachments
1-crazy-roads.jpg
Crazy road again. Not good for people that have motion sickness.
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2-Farrellones.jpg
Farrellones, the place where I was dropped off. If you're skiing for a few days, this is a better option than Santiago.
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3-Farrellones-El_Colorado.jpg
Farrellones restaurant and t-bar connecting El Colorado on the left. El Colorado summit and road runs below resort boundary.
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4-El_Colorado_La_Parva.jpg
Picture taken riding the Farrellones T-Bar connecting with El Colorado. View of El Colorado resort with La Parva runs and resort beyond.
4-El_Colorado_La_Parva.jpg (49.36 KiB) Viewed 11218 times
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Sat May 17, 2008 11:41 pm

Farellones is a junction in the road and the non-resort place to stay when you don’t want to stay in the resorts of Valle Nevado, El Colorado or La Parva. Farrellones has a tiny hill with lifts that is connected to the greater El Colorado about 300 meters higher. El Colorado is a volcanic cone, from the base on the West Face (ski area’s main side), the runs get steeper the higher you get. The bottom half is the face which is about 200m is served by a few lifts and is pretty much green land (easy runs). The top 300m are red runs (intermediate) with a very regular slope and was very popular for different race camps. Terrain doesn’t really change regardless which line you choose on the West Face, what else I can say, it’s a cone. After a few runs on hard frozen granular next the different courses, I moved on to the steeper East Face. Definitely more Springish surfaces, although still frozen for the first few runs. After that I started looking at the other face. There are some nice runs plus a nice face of ungroomed terrain further down along the Condor chair, unfortunately that lift wasn’t running.

Moved to Cono Este side of the mountain. This side of the cone has steeper runs in bounds; the most interesting stuff would be lower out of bounds and skiing toward the road to Valle Nevado. It was not going to happen today for myself; I was skiing solo and had the clock in mind. After one run on the steeper corn side of Cono Este. It was close to noon as I took back the t-bar to the top, I decided that I’d better look into skiing toward La Parva before the 2pm rendez-vous time I had set with Andy. I saw a group of skiers, one of them had BRO skis, I said to myself that they were probably Americans and could maybe confirm the way to get to La Parva. I was able to talk to one of them, but he wasn’t sure. The connection between El Colorado and La Parva isn’t marked and easy like the ones from Valle Nevado. Fortunately, someone was able to confirm the connection and inform me that they wasn’t any terrain traps.

The connection in through a fairly unmarked open and relatively flat traverse behind at the base of the other side of the Cone, terrain that had a few knolls or ridge and small gully (creek bed). Snow coverage was okay, but the base wasn’t very far in some places. I had to remove the ski for cross a snow less ridge then look to make sure I would connect with the La Parva.

At the bottom of La Parva lift, I had to try to figure out if they had many combo lift ticket with El Colorado or sold half days or something. This was harder to do when the lady at the ticket booth only understood Spanish and my Spanish wasn’t good enough in order. Ended up having to buy another day ticket for La Parva.

It was already 12:30 and I had 90 minutes to get back at the bottom of Cono Este t-bar for the rendez-vous spot I had set with Andy. Did a quick look at the map to figure out what I could do? I took 5 lifts and skied 300 meters vertical to reach the place where I could crossover. This took me 90 minutes. Conditions were great corn, mountain definitely seems to have a better variety than El Colorado, unfortunately I didn’t want have to much time to explore.

At 13:15, I was staring at where I wanted to go. I wasn’t sure how to get there, eventually crossover into Valle Nevado trail network always stayed on skiers’ right all the way skied the 600m vertical to the bottom of Cono Este without requiring another lift and going a long traverse. This connection was easy than anticipated and arrived 30 minutes ahead of time. Decided to eat my lunch here and wait to see if Andy would show up.
Attachments
5-el_colorado_main_side.jpg
El Colorado main face which Santiago smog below. View of closed Condor chairlift.
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6-t-bar_and_valle_nevado.jpg
View from the top of Cono Este T-Bar and Valle Nevado in the distance.
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7-going_to_la_parva.jpg
Traverse to LaParva via the backside of El Colorado.
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8-la_parva.jpg
View of the La Parva terrain.
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9-la_parva_to_el_colorado.jpg
From the top of La Parva, I need to get to the left side of El Colorado on the other side of that ridge.
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10-cono_este.jpg
Back to El Colorado and view of the Cono Este T-Bar.
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11-cristal.jpg
View of the main face of El Colorado from the restaurant,rendez-vous spot #2.
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Last edited by Patrick on Sun May 18, 2008 12:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Sun May 18, 2008 12:12 am

After 30 minutes, it was 2pm and Andy wasn’t there. I decided to ski a few runs on this lift, which was okay because this was the best part of the mountain, the face was nice and corny :P Someone had the slide for life by falling off the very steep top of the T-bar, this girl really scared herself and slide a long way.

After 2:30 I headed toward the next rendez-vous spot #2 which was a nice on mountain restaurant like the ones that can be found in the Alps (and the Andes apparently). Meet Andy and Brendan just before 3pm meeting time. They just started skiing at 2:30. I was actually amazed that they made it, having just arrived at the airport a few hours earlier. Headed back to Cono Este and ski the steeps with Andy and Brendan. After a few run, we went back to that same restaurant for a refueling break. We finished off on the front face and skied through the terrain park for our last run toward the car.

The adventure is moving further South, but that is going to be another day. 8)
Attachments
12-cono_Este_tbar.jpg
Ridding the Cono Este T-bar (photo by Brendan/Andy).
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13-Greasy Chuevos.jpg
Greasy Chuevos with the British Ski Club. (photo by Andy)
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14-Pat_Andy.jpg
Pat and Andy before one of the last run of August. (photo by Andy)
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map_el_colorado1.jpg
El Colorado and view of Farrellones connection t-bar map. Note: numbers/letters correspond with graph below.
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map_el_colorado2.jpg
El Colorado (main face 2) map. Note: numbers/letters correspond with graph below.
map_el_colorado2.jpg (61.17 KiB) Viewed 11206 times
map_el_colorado3.jpg
El Colorado (Este Cono) map. Note: numbers/letters correspond with graph below. #18 missing - skied close to #13.
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map-laparva.jpg
La Parva map. Note: numbers/letters correspond with graph below.
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2-el_colorado_la_parva.jpg
Suunto S6 log. Note: numbers/letters correspond with maps.
Break: 1) La Parva buying a ticket.
2) Lunch at the bottom of Cono Este
3 and 4) Restaurant solo and with Andy & Brendan
2-el_colorado_la_parva.jpg (70.39 KiB) Viewed 11174 times
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Tony Crocker » Sun May 18, 2008 1:19 pm

If you're skiing for a few days, this [Farellones] is a better option than Santiago.
Your description of the bus ride clinches that impression, for sure.

rendez-vous spot #2 which was a nice on mountain restaurant like the ones that can be found in the Alps (and the Andes apparently).
From your map, is that marked D by the Cornisa T-bar at El Colorado? I don't remember a restaurant in that area, but I was skiing Cornisa in a fog bank :o .

I was not impressed at all with on-mountain food at Valle Nevado and La Parva. Tio Bob at Portillo and Santa Fe at Las Lenas are good, and Cima at Las Lenas is better.

But the on-mountain restaurants at Verbier, Courmayeur and Serre Chevalier are in a completely different league.

Nice navigation job considering the timing and the rendezvous. From the the pic at the bottom of Farellones, I see traverse tracks coming in from the right below the cliffs. Can you go OB skier's right from Cono Este and make it around to Farellones via a long traverse? That's probably a question for Geoff, but it would make El Colorado a lot more attractive to experts if that's possible.

=D> =D> =D> to skibum4ever for lighting a fire under Patrick and getting these reports resumed.
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Re: re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Geoff » Sun May 18, 2008 3:33 pm

Tony Crocker wrote:Nice navigation job considering the timing and the rendezvous. From the the pic at the bottom of Farellones, I see traverse tracks coming in from the right below the cliffs. Can you go OB skier's right from Cono Este and make it around to Farellones via a long traverse? That's probably a question for Geoff, but it would make El Colorado a lot more attractive to experts if that's possible.



I've skied that a number of times but I've always stopped at the Valle Nevado access road. I've stayed at Valle Nevado and never had a reason to ski any lower. It's tough enough to find a driver to pick you up and there's big competition if you are trying to hitchhike.
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Re: re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Mon May 19, 2008 12:30 am

Tony Crocker wrote:
rendez-vous spot #2 which was a nice on mountain restaurant like the ones that can be found in the Alps (and the Andes apparently).
From your map, is that marked D by the Cornisa T-bar at El Colorado? I don't remember a restaurant in that area, but I was skiing Cornisa in a fog bank :o .

If you notice, I skied my 15th passed the based on the Cornisa T-bar to continue on toward the restaurant at the base of the Triple (C). Run #16 is the same as run #4 of graph/map.

Tony Crocker wrote: From the the pic at the bottom of Farellones, I see traverse tracks coming in from the right below the cliffs. Can you go OB skier's right from Cono Este and make it around to Farellones via a long traverse?

No, that cat track wasn't that long. I believe that the cat track might extends only to the area below the Condor lift. I think I saw a lift or two (rope tows) lower down. Farrellones had a few beginner lifts, they biggest lift was the one connecting with the base of El Colorado.
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Agosto 31 - Aprt

Postby Patrick » Mon May 19, 2008 2:26 am

Agosto 31 - Après-ski ;) :

El Colorado to ???


So I was finally able to tag up with Andy and Brendan at El Colorado, so I didn’t need take the bus back down to Santiago and THEN hoped that they could find my Hostal and rendez-vous spot #3 in Downtown Santiago.

Back at Andy’s car, I started wondering how the hell we could fit everything in this rental for our voyage. The car was already packed with 5 pairs of skis and their gear. :shock: :shock: :shock: Mine was still in the Hostel down in Santiago. After struggling to fit on the backseat with my ski boots on, the car wouldn’t start. :x :x #-o The battery was dead and we needed to get to Farrellones to recuperate my things like my shoes that I left on the bus. The pickup time was 5:30, it was currently something like 5:27. [-o< [-o< We pushed the car back on the road and down. Once it started rolling faster in neutral we jumped in, eventually the car started \:D/ and we got at the Farrellones at the same time as the bus. :oops:

Once I got my stuff from the bus and took off my ski boots, we were all set. The final destination was approximately 500km (300 miles) away in Las Trancas, however I wasn’t sure how far we would get. Andy wanted to drive as long as he could. Andy and Brendan had just arrived after an overnight flight from Canada and skied a few hours plus we needed to do something about this car. There was no way we could drive over one thousand miles in our current setup. [-X I had 5 pairs of skis within inches from my face, not a comfortable and safe way to see South America, especially on crazy mountain roads. :? Lets just say that I almost got a shave from the skis. There was discussion of our car options during this descent. Instead of going back to the airport and getting a larger rental car, Andy mentioned that we could probably fixed something up. :roll:

After stopping at a few ski shops in Santiago, we finally headed for this Mall. The biggest sport mall I had even seen. Only sport stores in the size of a suburban mall. This is what I found on the internet about this mall:

Canadian Government Source for Mall info.

Chile's first mall exclusively devoted to selling sporting goods will open next September 2004. The investment, US$26 million, is 100% Chilean. Is one of the largest department stores in Chile. The mall will be located in Avenida Las Condes and Fernandez Concha, a 18,000 square meter ground.This shopping center will include 62 stores in the sporting goods industry as well as clothing and equipment related to each sporting area. Two levels of stores, a food court, two levels of parking for 750 cars, an artificial lagoon surrounded by 7 formal restaurants, a fitness center, a spa, a sports health center, an indoor pool, a shooting polygon, and an area of multipurpose courts are projected for this sports mall. Among the companies contracted to be in the mall are Bata with New Balance, Sparta and Athletes World. This is a new business format for Chile, but according to analysts this is an answer to the market needs. Pablo Reszczynski, General Manager of this project, says “Mall Sport was born mainly from the idea of assembling in only one place sporting goods stores currently all over Santiago. We have noticed that the big channels of distribution and wholesale of sporting goods are not specialized.”


Let me just say that we were all impressed. As we walked all over the place looking for God knows what?. :roll: We eventually bought some rope in a boating store and a yoga mat in order to built a Chilean roof rack. :idea: Brendan was initially looking for noodles, the type of noodles that go with Swimming, but couldn’t find any, so he bought a yoga mat instead. Back in the underground parking, we started building our roof rack. Andy and Brendan are kayakers, so they were pretty confident that this would work and hold, even at 130kmh. :shock: [-o<

Once everything was set up, we headed downtown, got the rest of my gear at the Hostal downtown and proceeded to fill every cubic feet still available in the car. It was pretty late when we left Santiago, maybe 9pm. After eating on the road, we headed off the Trans American Highway at midnight looking for a place to sleep. We weren’t going to make it to Las Trancas or Chillàn for that matter. We spotted Hostal sign on the side of the road, it looked like a individual home. It was midnight and we found a place to sleep in Talca. This was roughly half way to Las Trancas. :D

Next day we ski in Termas.\:D/\:D/\:D/

PS. I'll have limited access to my home computer in this coming week, so you'll have to wait (not as long as last time :roll: ...I hope) before the next Chapter.
Attachments
building_a_skirack.jpg
Pat and Andy getting the skis organized for the skirack in the underground garage of the Mega Sportmall in Santiago. (Photo by Brendan)
building_a_skirack.jpg (53.23 KiB) Viewed 11157 times
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Tony Crocker » Mon May 19, 2008 11:41 am

Yes, that car looks a bit small. The definition of "compact" in U.S. and Canada is a bit different elsewhere in the world. Might want to try Johnny Kay's Murano next time. Adam, Ben and I had a tight fit in the Dodge Caliber (midsize?) rental from Calgary last February. We did get the skis inside, but the other stuff was piled all the way to the roof.

Adam remembered this while shopping for the WRX, which has similar room inside. These compact wagons will take skis diagonally with one rear seat down, but probably would not have 20 years ago when most skis were over 190cm. His surfboard will not fit diagonally, so his limit is one surfboard (on the center console between the front seats) unless he gets a rack.

I do remember seeing a restaurant at the base of that El Colorado triple. I didn't eat lunch that day as I knew we were going to hit a top restaurant in Santiago that night.
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby skibum4ever » Wed May 21, 2008 1:01 pm

Patrick, thanks for the next chapter. We enjoyed reading it and especially seeing the photos. 8)
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Re: re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Wed May 21, 2008 1:21 pm

Tony Crocker wrote:Yes, that car looks a bit small. The definition of "compact" in U.S. and Canada is a bit different elsewhere in the world. Might want to try Johnny Kay's Murano next time.

Small is an understatement. It wasn't my call as it wasn't my rental. Andy didn't mind one bit about the small car. :roll: Fortunately everything got sorted out once we put the skis on the roof.

skibum4ever wrote:Patrick, thanks for the next chapter. We enjoyed reading it and especially seeing the photos.


I need to finish the September 1st chapter and resize some pictures. Hopefully I'll get it on-line by this weekend, all depends when I can use the home computer.
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Tony Crocker » Wed May 21, 2008 4:08 pm

all depends when I can use the home computer.
Midnight to 6AM it's often available :lol: .
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Fri May 23, 2008 11:06 pm

September 1 - the morning after:

Talca to Termas?


Okay, what happens when you take a 12-hour overnight flight ski a few hours at 3000 meters then drive until midnight? You don’t get up in the morning. Or maybe it’s just Andy? So we found this Hostal in Talca. This Hostal is in fact an individual house with a few rooms to rent. We found out when we arrived here that Canadians were “Persona non grata” in Chile or maybe with this Football (Soccer) fan owner (see why in link below)

CTV News (July 20, 07): Chile officials blame Toronto police for soccer brawl

Anyway, our reception in the Hostal wasn’t that bad and he was nice to us, but he had to let us know that he wasn’t happy about the incidences in Toronto. After a late breakfast we headed back on the Trans American Highway in direction of Chillàn at 10ish in the morning. :shock: :shock: Chillàn is about 160 km then another 80 km to Termas. Not sure if we going to ski today? We noticed on the roads that our setup with the skis was probably better than a few that we passed along the way. :roll: The drive is fairly straight and we can see the Andes and a few volcanos to the East of us.

We left the highway in Chillàn and turned left toward the Andes. Scenery isn’t the same as near Santiago. As we get closer to Termas we drive through the woods compared to the very dry field with cactuses near the Santiago ski areas. We passed through a few villages and we also saw some peasants sitting at road side next to homemade rack selling gloves or things like an 80s style one piece ski suits.

We arrived at Las Trancas and checked in at our accommodations at the Chil’In at 2pm. After a quick discussion, we decided to go skiing anyway and head to the local ski area 7km away at the end of the road. This even if we would only have time for a couple of runs at the most. :) It’s Spring time in Las Trancas with some snow still present on the ground, the road from the village to the resort isn’t paved and there are just a few switch backs, but nowhere near to road to Farrellones. As we get closer, we get a glimpse of the mountain and are very impressed. Not sure what is in or out-of-bounds, but the mountain is impressive. =P~ =P~ =P~ We parked in the upper parking lot and hurry to buy our full day lift ticket. :roll:

No mapa de pista in las manos, we hesitate between the triple and the double. No time to think, we hop on the old double. As we slowly climb, we realized we picked the right chair as this lift is much longer as the triple we saw. The higher we get, the most amazed our long this lift is and by the beauty of the terrain that is revealed. We just took the Dono Oto lift which 2.5km long with a vertical of 700meters. Lookers’ right is pretty much the resort’s boundary and so we traverse to the left. We totally freak out as we notice in the distance a t-bar that goes higher followed by then another one. The possibilities are endless. =P~ \:D/

We decided to go to the top of the last lift and ski along the ski area boundary on our right not far from the outer trail. The terrain is a natural terrain park with a bunch of rolls, sidewalls and cornices. The untracked snow is wet and heavy, difficult to ski in. We rejoined the trail just above treeline and we find a kicker built by some snowboarder right in the middle of the trail before a pitch. Andy urged Brendan to go big, he does and.... crashes sideways. Found out that Brendan has had a few concussions and he literary doesn’t have any depth perception. WTF??? Now I know what this guy has been giving me a hard time about my lack of helmet. :) Hell of the skier that isn’t afraid to take risks going big. Would you believe if I tell you this guy is a ski patrol? Andy is the other ski patrol and fellow Masters racer, an amazing skier that makes it look easy. He’s suppose to take it easy as he coming back from a broken leg. We skied all the way down for 15-20 minutes for over 1100 meters and 13km. This long trail makes it to the bottom of the resort next to the Termas hotels and village.

Down at 1600m, one chair connect with the base area with main lifts 120 higher where we started from. We take the triple this time which much shorter. We decide to continue to the top via the detachable poma and the two t-bars we took before the previous run. Skied a groomer from the top then moved slightly between runs on the steeper bottom. Unfortunately it was passed 4:30pm and the Doto Oto was closed so we headed for the Triple for last run.

WOW!!! \:D/ \:D/ \:D/ We are going to have fun here. I can’t wait to ski tomorrow.
Attachments
1-chilean_roof_box.jpg
Andy getting the Chilean Roof box ready for departure. (photo by Brendan)
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2-car2.jpg
Our KIA from another angle. Almost felt like a circus act trying to get everything loaded.
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3-truck.jpg
Truck on the highway. I guess our ski rack isn't that bad after all.
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4-chillan.jpg
In Chillàn, turn left toward the volcanos. :-)
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5-gloves.jpg
Local sitting at the road side next to homemade rack selling gloves.
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6-not_far_las_trancas.jpg
Maybe a couple of kilometers just before getting into Las Trancas.
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7-OhMy.jpg
Our first clear view of the place.
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8-where-are-here.jpg
Where are finally here. This looks good!!!
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Last edited by Patrick on Fri May 23, 2008 11:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Fri May 23, 2008 11:18 pm

Here are some shots from Andy and Brendan on the mountain plus the log. I didn't bother getting my camera for this short ski day.
Attachments
9-terrain_beyond.jpg
WOW!!! Pat pointing to terrain beyond and Brendan (photo by Andy).
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10-pat_brendan2.jpg
Brendan and Pat on that long trail. Volcanos in the background (photo by Andy).
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11-Andy.jpg
Andy making some turns. (photo by Brendan)
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map-termas.jpg
Mapa de pistas. Note: numbers/letters correspond with graph below.
map-termas.jpg (91.59 KiB) Viewed 11020 times
3-termas_log.jpg
Suunto S6 log. Note: numbers/letters correspond with maps.
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re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Tony Crocker » Sat May 24, 2008 8:23 pm

From the map the lifts are all scrunched together like Valle Nevado but the terrain looks more expansive.

Are the fall lines along the D and I lifts good? Is the off-piste between runs 13-15 and the main part of the area mostly skiable?
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Tony Crocker
 
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Re: re: Chilean Adventure (the novel- Part 2) Aug/Sep 07

Postby Patrick » Sun May 25, 2008 9:44 am

Tony Crocker wrote:From the map the lifts are all scrunched together like Valle Nevado but the terrain looks more expansive.


This map is probably as bad as La Parva in representing terrain.

Tony Crocker wrote:Are the fall lines along the D and I lifts good?


I've added the stats from the mapa de pista that I have. It can give you a feel which lifts would potentially have the best fall line. Every lifts are generally fall line, however lifts H & I are pretty flat intermediate terrain. C & D are the best on-piste steeps. K (added blackline). We didn't see anything except towers for lift J and L. Come to think of it, not even sure they were towers for L. :roll:

Lift K wasn't build where it's written on the map, it starts next to the base of G - I've added a black line on the map where the actual K lift is.


length vertical %
A double 1050 120 11
B poma 366 41 11
C triple 1100 350 32
D double 2500 700 28
E poma 400 30 8
F double 450 32 7
G poma 1305 275 21
H t-bar 3000 220 7
I t-bar 1500 200 13
J t-bar 593 197 33
K double 1600 390 24
(not the K from the map, black line next to G)
L poma 300 130 43

Tony Crocker wrote:Is the off-piste between runs 13-15 and the main part of the area mostly skiable?


The picture #10 was taken probably where 13 becomes 16 on the map. The runs are groomers that generally runs in the main valleys. I believe that picture #9 was taken just pass the top of lift K not far from top of H. You can see that pretty green blue run, but the fall line is constant so you can pick up some speed.

Anyway, you'll see more pics from the other days. However I'll not divulge on the internet where they were taken on the map. [-X
Last edited by Patrick on Sun May 25, 2008 10:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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