Jay Peak, VT: 12/01/07

[riverc0il]

Jay Peak needs to do everyone a favor and fire up the Bonaventure. Not even so much for the terrain (been there, done that, don't need the lift, thanks!) but rather because more uphill capacity is needed. All those triple major passes must have sold real well, because lots more college kids are at Jay this year. The snow is there and the crowds merit an extra lift. Getting the Freezer online would also be helpful instead of the Bonni.

That off my chest, somewhere around 6" fell in the last 24 hours but I would include the snow that fell today in that total. I was disappointed to see not much fresh snow on the trails due to being picked clean by the wind. Lower Power Line and Lower Lift Line were nice and I am sure Lower Can Am would have been great but I never got there. Trees generally had a few inches here and there. Still crust under the dust. Timbuk, Kitz, Hells, Stateside, Bonaventure, and Show Off were open for tree options. After hitting all the trees in the AM, I took a break to warm up and then the crowds showed up pushing lift lines out of the corrals. I held on for four more runs where I struck jack pot 6" fresh where I should have just started the morning. Off map glades should be ready to go after Monday I think, coverage is decent but still a lot of crap in there.

Interesting sound of the day was whacking my helmet into branches hanging low due to ice from last week... the shattering sound of ice breaking off branches, sometimes the branches themselves braking, and crashing to the ground.

Not sure where I am heading tomorrow. Might just do Cannon for a few runs on the cheap as I am not sure if Jay is worth the four hour round trip two days in a row in its current state. Lots of frozen cat tracks, ice, thin cover, and waterbars to deal with to get to the good skiing.

 

[riverc0il]

Photo Gallery has a few shots. For some perspective, this was last year on December 3rd at Jay: one trail from one chair.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Still not too exciting IMHO. But I'll bet Riverc0il will have a mouth watering report for us on Tuesday from somewhere.

 

[Patrick]

Still not too exciting IMHO.

Are you talking of the Eastern season so far or specifically River's December 1st Jay report. :?:

If it's the Eastern so far? Nothing could be further from the truth, at least from my perspective from my day at MSA last Sunday. [-(

 

[riverc0il]

Still not too exciting IMHO. But I'll bet Riverc0il will have a mouth watering report for us on Tuesday from somewhere.

I got nothing going mid-week unfortunately. Meetings and events everyday with no hope of cancellation unless the University shuts down, which isn't going to happen as we are not going to get hit that hard in the Plymouth area. "Still" nothing too exciting? Two weekends ago was pretty damn exciting and probably a top ten weekend for the year. It was certainly more exciting than what you are skiing right now, that is for sure....

 

[icelanticskier]

i'll be somewhere on tues-wed depending on wind from monday, snowfall, upslope potential and if i'll ski lifts or skin and ski a not opened yet resort.
i'm thinking lifts tuesday and closed area wednesday.
will report back
rog

 

[Tony Crocker]

I was referring to today's report. The ice/crust layer from Thanksgiving week seems to be still much in evidence, but I suspect it will be well buried by Tuesday.

I can't say I was that impressed by the Mt. St. Anne report last weekend, as it was probably similar travel time for Patrick as L.A. to Mammoth. I thought the north side of St. Anne was pretty flat when I was there in 2003.

St. Anne claims 56% open this weekend, which must mean some of the longer front side. That south facing front was not in great shape on my March visit, but I imagine it's better in midwinter.

 

[riverc0il]

I was referring to today's report. The ice/crust layer from Thanksgiving week seems to be still much in evidence, but I suspect it will be well buried by Tuesday.

Gotcha, I thought you meant "still" as in season to date. The Thanksgiving rain/freeze/snow event made for a total bomber base which is why Jay is able to offer tree skiing right now... no need to worry about buried snow snakes because the base is solid and obstacles are clearly visible. But after this weekend, we should see a massive amount of terrain open and packed powder conditions on all trails following the storm.... at least until the next rain/freeze event which seems like will be an imminent problem this season for the East once the cold spell snaps. La Nina is more than weak from what I read which means bad news so we'll take what we can get.

 

[Patrick]

I can't say I was that impressed by the Mt. St. Anne report last weekend, as it was probably similar travel time for Patrick as L.A. to Mammoth. I thought the north side of St. Anne was pretty flat when I was there in 2003.

St. Anne claims 56% open this weekend, which must mean some of the longer front side. That south facing front was not in great shape on my March visit, but I imagine it's better in midwinter.

1) That's because I might be more neutral in my reporting + I don't have any pictures. How many times can you ski run in November without needing tuned skis? As a reference, I needed tuned ski at Jackson Hole on January 26th 2006.

2) Yes, the drive is long. But I was just saying that MSA had great conditions. BTW, I heard Tremblant also had great stuff that weekend.

3) % of open trails. Again you cannot use this as a criteria for good conditions. MSA didn't have the Westside t-bar running on any of the Southside runs open. This is clearly, in my opinion, an economic driven issue, not a conditions or snow issue. This especially after I'm hearing stuff about RCR state of affairs.

 

[Tony Crocker]

No, I think the southside runs probably had thin cover your weekend and would have been torn up if people had been allowed to ski them in significant numbers. Last week's snow and snowmaking have presumably created an adequate base on some of the front side so they feel confident opening those runs and not having to close them again.

% of open trails. Again you cannot use this as a criteria for good conditions.

Sorry, but I do. I caught Powder Bowl at Mammoth on its first day open on snowmaking, and I'm sure its surface was similar to what you had at St. Anne. But Mammoth is still getting a "D" in my charts for last weekend. And this one too, despite the addition of Stump Alley and Cornice.

I'm not trying to be confrontational with the questions. Since I created the Vermont chart over the summer, I want to maintain it going forward. For weekends that are borderline, responses to the questions may assist in my decisions. The objective of the charts is not to praise or belittle Vermont conditions, but to be consistent with what I've been doing with the Southern California chart for the past 30 years.

Since the better Vermont areas have more vertical and acreage than SoCal (except Baldy), I recognize that 30% in Vermont might be the equivalent of 50% at Big Bear or Mountain High. And I definitely want to give credit for powder on that 30%, like Riverc0il's report 2 weeks ago.

The increase of St. Anne to 56% this weekend is supportive of Patrick's opinion (on the Christmas trip thread) that the Quebec City areas' colder temps than Vermont can be a meaningful assist in early season. But Vermont will probably catch up and maybe surpass with the impending storm.

La Nina is a mild positive for Jay/Smuggs/Stowe snowfall.

 

[Patrick]

No, I think the southside runs probably had thin cover your weekend and would have been torn up if people had been allowed to ski them in significant numbers.

I don't think so on the Upper South side, although I don't have any first hand account of this.

Last week's snow and snowmaking have presumably created an adequate base on some of the front side so they feel confident opening those runs and not having to close them again.

Here is the economical issue playing again, MSA could have choose to make snow on these runs (they had started, but modestly). RCR didn't try to open Stoneham before this weekend. IF there would have made opened those runs with snowmaking those runs, they wouldn't have close them I assure you.

% of open trails. Again you cannot use this as a criteria for good conditions.

Sorry, but I do. I caught Powder Bowl at Mammoth on its first day open on snowmaking, and I'm sure its surface was similar to what you had at St. Anne.

I wasn't skiing artificial snow Tony. Glades and Westside was open and 100% natural.

The increase of St. Anne to 56% this weekend is supportive of Patrick's opinion (on the Christmas trip thread) that the Quebec City areas' colder temps than Vermont can be a meaningful assist in early season. But Vermont will probably catch up and maybe surpass with the impending storm.

I believe that I mentioned recently that...

You might not find the best conditions in the East prior to Christmas if it's really good elsewhere, but conditions are safer than New England for that time of year (late season also). So if it's sucks elsewhere, odds are that it going to suck less in MSA.

However you forget that this storm is also going to dump on us here also and is moving along the St.Lawrence. Yeck, we went sliding today. BTW Mont Comi open this weekend with 100% open.

The only issue about Ste-Anne is RCR related now. :roll:

 

[Patrick]

A quick note. Today's report mentioned that 42/66 trails were open today.

Tony, conditions that I encountered last weekend as in the upper 10% for a season, regardless of the time of the year. I am sure that Wolverine, Quebec City's Queen of Fat skis, would agree with me on this one (ie. she seeks out Powder more than I do).

Another note regarding the snow. How can the cross-country skiing be open at MSA one week before the opening and the conditions on the hill a few weeks later (and extra snow) be so bad. :roll:

 

[BigJay]

I was there Sat and Sun. Crowds were OK compare to last week...

Freezer didn't run today (sun) because they had troubles with the electronic sensors... They still put the chairs on the cable but couldn't get the lift to run... Typicall Jay Peak!

Conditions in the woods were great... 10in in most places when you looked for it... And sometimes only 4-6in. Trails got icy pretty quick... You could still enjoy the mix of ice, pow and frozen granular under the chair... That was fun...

Climbing the Northway to access trails was pretty easy... to grommed it and they had boot tracks all over... Felt like thousands of people went for a hike in the last 2 days!

IN all it was a great w-e for early December... Now i'm waiting for tuesday to get some air! I feel a fever coming on... Oh well!
:twisted:

 

[Tony Crocker]

I don't think so on the Upper South side

You can't let people ski the upper if the lower has inadequate cover. I don't recall there being lifts for just the upper part of the front side.

How can the cross-country skiing be open at MSA one week before the opening

Because X-C can be done safely on a much thinner base.

I know RCR's reputation and don't particularly want to defend them. You are probably correct that if they had been more aggressive about snowmaking earlier, they might have gotten some frontside runs open a week earlier.

Patrick, you can consider yourself still on assignment for compiling some historical Quebec snowfall data.

 

[Patrick]

I don't think so on the Upper South side

You can't let people ski the upper if the lower has inadequate cover. I don't recall there being lifts for just the upper part of the front side.

Being really conservative you are probably correct, however there is an Upper Southside lift that is accessible on the steeper side of the mountain. The bottom runout (green run) wouldn't require that much snow.

How can the cross-country skiing be open at MSA one week before the opening

Because X-C can be done safely on a much thinner base.

Agree, however the cross-country skiing had some stuff open on the bottom of the South side two weeks prior to my weekend. Since that time, MSA got much more snow.

 

[wolverine]

conditions that I encountered last weekend as in the upper 10% for a season, regardless of the time of the year. I am sure that Wolverine, Quebec City's Queen of Fat skis, would agree with me on this one (ie. she seeks out Powder more than I do).

I agree!
No rain or any wet/ too warm temperature from mid-Nov until now at MSA. That ski resort opened some double black trails last week end like S, Super S (the twins), Crete, Canyon (tight), Gondola and Brunelle (longest wood at Mont-Ste-Anne). Some on natural snow. And now another storm: 10 inches maybe more.
Tomorrow (maybe according to North-East wind) to put some pictures here!