ski area myth busters - good or bad

[jimk]

The recent Revelstoke thread started by @ChrisC brought to the surface some feelings from many that, while a fine ski area, Revy doesn't always live up to it's myth of 5000+ vertical feet of fabulous tree skiing in uncontested powder.

What other ski areas have you visited that either failed to meet your pre-trip expectations or greatly exceeded them? What are your myth-buster or myth-builder ski experiences?

I'll start with a positive. For decades I heard things about Breckenridge that discouraged me from visiting. The town was swamped with tourists, most of the trails were crowded, flat and wind swept, the elevation of the layout was unpleasantly high for visiting flatlanders, parking sucked, etc. I spent the month of March 2015 living in Summit County and skied Breckenridge on seven different days. I've been back to ski it two or three times since. There is a basis in truth for some of the derogatory stereotypes about Breckenridge, but once I experienced the place I actually liked it a lot and found acceptable work-arounds for any negatives.
The high alpine areas are huge, fun and have better snow conditions than the bowls at many other Rocky Mtn resorts. I really enjoyed the hike-to terrain, particularly the chutes and slopes above Peaks 6 and 8, which are relatively easy to reach from the Kensho and Imperial chairs, respectively. At least for me, it seemed easy to avoid base area crowds by heading high and/or wide on the huge trail layout. There is challenging and low traffic tree skiing in a number of places on the hill including around the E, 6, and Falcon chairs. I don't mind using the free and large airport parking lot and taking the short shuttle bus ride from there to the Breck Connect Gondola to start my day. There's no escaping the high elevation, but it kind of comes with the territory in Colorado. Going slow on your first day can ease the adjustment. I find the casual dining around the town of Breckenridge to be slightly more affordable than some other big name ski resort towns.

A few of my relevant photos:

George's Thumb from the summit of Peak 8's Imperial chair.

Snowboarder stops to scope out the Lake Chutes expert terrain after hiking to the summit of Peak 8 about the Imperial Chair, elevation 12,998'.

I took this photo from Keystone ski area. It shows Peak 8 with the Imperial chair in center Lake Chutes to lookers left, George's Thumb and Whale's Tail to lookers right. Due to their high elevation and generally ENE exposure the high alpine bowls at Breckenridge preserve good snow quality. Peak 8 (left) and Peak 7 (center) base areas can be seen below.

The Peak 6 summit and Kensho chair are to the right of this photo. There is excellent hike-to stuff from this lift all along the center ridge line. The elevation is something like 12.5k up there.

Psychopath in the Chair-6 trail pod beneath Peak 8.

Needle's Eye glade beneath Peak 9.

Mustang trail to the far lookers left of Peak 10.

It goes without saying that there are a ton of fine low angle groomer runs at Breck. My advice, hit them early or late in the day, or even better hit them anytime in late spring. This is beneath Peak 7.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Thanks, I've always been curious about Breckenridge but never had the opportunity to go (too expensive and/or locked into Epic Pass).

 

[ChrisC]

Breckenridge was the first non-East Coast area I skied - once in March (great!) and later of Christmas (horrific!). The second visit soured my on the mountain.

Since then, I have changed my opinion on Breckenridge 180 degrees because they opened the Imperial Bowl/Peak 8 Summit, allowed Peak 7 to be more easily accessed, expanded onto Peak 6, and created an easy parking link with the gondola. Also, the steep cruisers on Peak 10 are fun, T-bar bowls can get some great blow-in powder, and the bumps on Chairs E, 6 and Peak 8 Connect are legit.

Ten-to-Fifteen years ago, none of this existed and the mountain skied poorly - especially in the crowded early season.

Sunny, low-wind, weekdays days from mid-February onwards are optimal.


Crowded, less interesting Breck circa 2004

Today's more fun Breck 2021

 

[ChrisC]

Here is just a personal list of ski areas that have exceeded or not quite met expectations. Tried to include places have skied more than once and under good conditions. Likely missing some. Kept it West Coast.

Some mountains that have exceeded my expectations:
Whistler BC - alpine, vertical, global/British Commonwealth world culture
Fernie BC - bowls
Kicking Horse BC
Lake Lousie AB - bowls
Alpental WA - steep, sidecountry, be local to time conditions
Crystal Mountain WA - so much steep terrain, be local to time conditions
Mt Bachelor OR - the backside in spring
Mammoth CA - huge
Alpine Meadows CA - lots of semi -sidecountry terrain
Sugar Bowl CA - steep
Sun Valley ID - lodges, hs lifts and best US groomers
Schweitzer ID
Whitefish MT
Discovery Basin MT
Bridger Bowl MT - the ridge, Slushman's
Snowbasin UT - lodges, hs lifts, some great long lines, but low/prone to sun
Loveland CO - free cat, wrap around bowls
Snowmass CO - cirque, hanging valley, campground
Crested Butte CO - tons of steep stuff
Taos NM - the ridges, when snow
Ski Apache NM - desert views

Some areas that did not meet expectations:
Panorama BC - low snow
Nakiska AB - low snow
Timberline Lodge OR - flat
Heavenly CA - beautiful runs, just awkward layout/traverses
Park City UT - too much ridge skiing and traverses
Jackson Hole WY - too often wet snow/rain at the base, lower-half of the mountain often skunked, local macho attitude for 1-2 hr AM trams
Winter Park CO - Cirque too small/hard to repeat, Parsenn just ok, nothing overly special
Steamboat CO - few steeps
Ski Sunrise AZ - large, but just so poorly run (broken lifts, lodges, etc)

 

[tseeb]

Not trying to pick on ChrisC, but "Nakiska BC" is Calgary's closest mountain and in AB.
I had good day during warm winter in 2.2015 at Panorama, BC, when most of rest of BC had been hit by warm storms.
Agree on most of the rest except I've never seen the top of Fernie open and other bowls were shutting down due to avalanche danger on a couple of the better snow days I had there that were posted here (and are hard to find). Edit to add link https://www.firsttracksonline.com/boards/threads/fernie-b-c-feb-25-2018.12604/
My most disappointing area was Taos as I skied there in Dec. 1992 and snow was thin. It was much worse at Angel Fire. Santa Fe was better. Hoping NM gets some this year. I also was not sure about Canyons side of Park City as it seemed like a lot of the steeps to lookers right did not have much snow, there were some real estate runs and I some gravelly runs. Then local UT skier showed me and jimk some of good stuff a few years ago.

 

[Tony Crocker]

I try diligently to research ski area flaws in advance and hit them when those flaws are minimized. I would never set foot on Taos in December and rarely in January. There have been no big storms in NM so far this season, just a few inches here and there. With it being a La Nina year, I would be astounded if Kachina opens before February and the odds of a complete wipeout season like 2006 or 2018 are not trivial. That said, my 4 visits there, two in mid-February and two in late March/early April, were excellent. As for Ski Apache, it's highly dependent upon El Nino/La Nina and essentially can be written off in a La Nina year.

Breck's visitation vs. acreage stats are red flag for crowds. Accordingly I've skied there in two seasons, once pre-Christmas and once early April, both in huge snow years. I agree with jimk's and ChrisC's positive terrain comments, and I have to say snow preservation is superb above 11,500 feet even though the exposure is mostly east.

I have a long history of criticism of Jackson Hole for its primary SE exposure on steep terrain. But that particular flaw is predictable and is generally applicable only mid-February and later. All 3 of my trips earlier than that had good snow conditions, primarily due to the mid-winter inversions that keep the lower mountain temperatures down. We will be testing that pattern again this season. The crowd factor now needs to be considered at Jackson as its visits have doubled in the past 20 years, faster growth than its lift capacity.

Crested Butte I've visited 3x, all in early April when it should have a maximum snowpack. During none of those trips was the entire mountain open, and in 2007 less than 1/4 of the North Face was open after a 3 week dry spell. I believe CB is perhaps the least reliable destination resort in western North America in terms of open terrain.

Lake Louise consistently overperforms relative to its snowfall stats. Why? Canadian snowfall tends to be front-ended some vs. areas farther south, and since Banff is so cold October snow sticks and doesn't blow away or melt out as it does in most US resorts. I should probably try to get Louise/Sunshine October snow history and include it in season totals. In 20+ seasons Louise/Sunshine average half open Dec. 1 and 72% open Dec. 15.

Nakiska is heavily dependent upon manmade snow and that was known before it was developed for the 1988 OIympics. Panorama gets less snow than Lake Louise (I skied them on back to back days in 2004) but it probably had the best conditions in B.C. when tseeb and I skied there in the difficult and anomalous 2015 season.

Overall I probably agree with 90% of ChrisC's assessments above.

 

[jimk]

Here is just a personal list of ski areas that have exceeded or not quite met expectations. Tried to include places have skied more than once and under good conditions. Likely missing some. Kept it West Coast.

Some mountains that have exceeded my expectations:
Whistler BC
Fernie BC - bowls
Kicking Horse BC
Lake Lousie AB - bowls
Alpental WA - steep, sidecountry, be local to time conditions
Crystal Mountain WA - so much steep terrain, be local to time conditions
Mt Bachelor OR - the backside in spring
Mammoth CA - huge
Alpine Meadows CA - lots of semi -sidecountry terrain
Sugar Bowl CA - steep
Sun Valley ID - lodges, hs lifts and best US groomers
Schweitzer ID
Whitefish MT
Discovery Basin MT
Bridger Bowl MT - the ridge, Slushman's
Snowbasin UT - lodges, hs lifts, some great long lines, but low/prone to sun
Loveland CO - free cat, wrap around bowls
Snowmass CO - cirque, hanging valley, campground
Crested Butte CO - tons of steep stuff
Taos NM - the ridges, when snow
Ski Apache NM - desert views

Some areas that did not meet expectations:
Panorama BC - low snow
Nakiska AB - low snow
Timberline Lodge OR - flat
Heavenly CA - beautiful runs, just awkward layout/traverses
Park City UT - too much ridge skiing and traverses
Jackson Hole WY - too often wet snow/rain at the base, lower-half of the mountain often skunked, local macho attitude for 1-2 hr AM trams
Winter Park CO - Cirque too small/hard to repeat, Parsenn just ok, nothing overly special
Steamboat CO - few steeps
Ski Sunrise AZ - large, but just so poorly run (broken lifts, lodges, etc)

I've not skied much in the PNW or interior BC and have skied only about half the places on Chris's lists above.

Only time I've skied Bachelor was for three consecutive days in late Dec 2012. Backside was open and long tree runs off Northwest chair were in play. The backside skiing was an impressive and pretty unique experience for me as an East-Coaster:

I have only one day lifetime at Sugar Bowl, but I thought it had good terrain and a fascinating ski area history. It was Jan of 2013 on the same 3-week trip as Bachelor visit above. It wasn’t so huge (1,500 foot vertical drop) that you couldn’t find your bearings and get a fun taste of it on your first visit. Yet, it had some very robust terrain and was plenty big enough (1,500 acres) for some fun trailblazing.
Mt. Lincoln chair and Silver Belt trail at Sugar Bowl:

I'll post some more comments later.

 

[jimk]

Agree with Chris to an extent on his comments about these areas:

[Heavenly CA - beautiful runs, just awkward layout/traverses
Jackson Hole WY - too often wet snow/rain at the base, lower-half of the mountain often skunked, local macho attitude for 1-2 hr AM trams
Winter Park CO - Cirque too small/hard to repeat, Parsenn just ok, nothing overly special
Steamboat CO - few steeps]

I only made my first visit to Jackson Hole in 2015 and have visited it twice since then for a few days each time. Magnificent terrain and generally good conditions for my visits, but wow is that place crowded!

I'll add that many of the larger mtns I'm fond of are ones that I have more days at. In other words, if you have the time to really explore a place you eventually find the good stuff and develop a comfort factor with the layout. That's how I feel about Park City.

During the very snowy winter of 2019 I visited Crested Butte for the very first time for two days in late February in peak mid-season form. It was so fun and so well suited to my personal preferences that I went back again for three days in early April of the same year for great spring conditions and the closing weekend party atmosphere. Both times I stayed at the Grand Lodge Crested Butte. The combo of snow, 100% open terrain, fun times, and slopeside accoms really gave me a rosy picture of the place. I have yet to return. What can I say?

 

[ChrisC]

Not trying to pick on ChrisC, but "Nakiska BC" is Calgary's closest mountain and in AB.
I had good day during warm winter in 2.2015 at Panorama, BC, when most of rest of BC had been hit by warm storms.
Agree on most of the rest except I've never seen the top of Fernie open and other bowls were shutting down due to avalanche danger on a couple of the better snow days I had there that were posted here (and are hard to find). Edit to add link https://www.firsttracksonline.com/boards/threads/fernie-b-c-feb-25-2018.12604/
My most disappointing area was Taos as I skied there in Dec. 1992 and snow was thin. It was much worse at Angel Fire. Santa Fe was better. Hoping NM gets some this year. I also was not sure about Canyons side of Park City as it seemed like a lot of the steeps to lookers right did not have much snow, there were some real estate runs and I some gravelly runs. Then local UT skier showed me and jimk some of good stuff a few years ago.

The 'Expectations Game' is so subjective to defend any placement too much. But some mountains get hyped - and live up to it - like Alta and Snowbird with snow/terrain/easy access, Deer Valley with its excellent food and groomers, Big Sky with its Lone Peak tram, Vail with its village/snow/back bowls, Aspen Highlands and its bowl, Sqauw Valley with tons of steep terrain, Mt Baker as a little area that rocks, etc.

I tried to remove bad timing from reviews by trying to visit ski areas during good coverage periods - and like Tony suggests - limits downsides. That's hard in the SW - since not every year had great coverage. But I did a road trip in 2010 when the SW was booming and the rest of the west was bad - Ski Apache (amazing setting), Sandia, Red River (fun town), Angel Fire, Sante Fe (unique place), Taos ( Euro-like atmosphere, pueblo, steep skiing, bumps/trees). Was not expecting much, but it was amazing.

My first time at Fernie was a refrozen crud day in March 2002, but see the potential as the sun softened snow. Later years I was lucky to ski with 6" and 18" dumps.

Nakiska should not exist as a resort. Not enough snow. Some of the worst snowmaking conditions ever. Only developed since Canada would not allow any 1988 Calgary Olympic ski events in Banff Park.

Jackson Hole. Ski a bit frequently since my brother's best friend/family friend lives there. Just too many rain and/or cement snow events in January. Most of the best terrain is below 8k feet (Hoback, Faces, Apres Vous, Moran Faces. Plus mostly south and east exposures?! A third of the time just great conditions in Feb or Jan. But too many misses in March and January. And the attitude - much worse than Squaw. I am more used to the liberal Telluride stoners doing their backcountry laps and not bragging about it. Jackson is beautiful and the terrain is there - and Teton Pass is special. But things can go wrong so quickly.

Other regions/Aside:

Europe - Generally any resort exceeds expectations for me since trail maps do not accurately convey the vastness of terrain. One resort I did not like - Les 2 Alpes. But that's it. I have done low snow but in January - so grassy/not rocky lower slopes skied fine. Just don't think you are going to be skiing lots of off-piste at Christmas at Zermatt.

East Coast - It's not quite fair to fair for me to rate this region, since I had no expectations growing up. But places I got to after 20 that were great: Sugarloaf, Mont Tremblant, Mt Ste. Anne, Le Massif, Gore Mt., Wildcat

Alaska Heli-skiing: Can be over-rated. Went 2x to Valdez. First time skied 50% of the time with 70"new over 6 days. Second time 80% fly time over 6 days with maybe 15" new. There is so much snow/terrain out there you do not really need much fresh. But so many people go there with only 0-25% fly time over a week. I am sure this happens about 1/3 of the weeks. So sad for a trip of a lifetime.

Just some thoughts.....feel free to disagree.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Big Sky with its Lone Peak tram

Completely inadequate to current demand. Capacity needs to be increased by a factor of 5
or alternatively a new fixed chairlift installed in Liberty Bowl.

Jackson Hole...... Just too many rain and/or cement snow events in January.

This strikes me as bad luck. Jackson Hole is a damn cold place most of the time midwinter and that valley is an inversion machine. By late February it's not bad luck; inversions become increasingly rare and the exposure is a killer in stronger sun.

"Most of the best terrain is below 8k feet (Hoback, Faces, Apres Vous, Moran Faces"
Very true, which is why it's annoying to see JHMR bragging about its high snowfall, measured over 9,000 feet and starting in October. As of today that number is 130 inches while the realistic number from 8,250 feet since Nov. 1 is 62 inches. Jackson is currently only 30% open and it's safe to say the lower elevation terrain ChrisC touts is struggling to get covered.

My first time at Fernie was a refrozen crud day in March 2002

Fernie has rain vulnerability, as I saw in 2003 and 2004. Its weather comes unobstructed from Washington State, which also gives it more snow than most places that far inland. If you are unlucky at Fernie, Castle usually has a higher proportion of terrain above the rain/snow line.

Alaska Heli-skiing: Can be over-rated.

To quote Dirty Harry, "Are you feeling lucky?" My first trip in 2007 yielded the best ski day of my life, so naturally I went back for more in 2011, 2012 and 2014.

only 0-25% fly time over a week.

I got 2 fly days of decent conditions out of a week in 2012 and two fly days of not great conditions in 2011 and 2014, so I'm probably done with Alaska heli.

All I can say about Crested Butte is that jimk was very lucky with conditions.

I'll add that many of the larger mtns I'm fond of are ones that I have more days at. In other words, if you have the time to really explore a place you eventually find the good stuff and develop a comfort factor with the layout. That's how I feel about Park City.

More experience counts, but along with that comes the ability to evaluate accurately on a shorter visit, especially if you know in context whether you're seeing good, average or bad conditions. My opinion stands that Park City is a third tier area in regional context. The proportion of time that I wouldn't rather be in LCC or BCC is miniscule. And if I'm trying to avoid crowds in the Cottonwoods I find Snowbasin's terrain distinctly superior to Park City and Deer Valley.

Regional context also applies to the Breckenridge comments. Its alpine terrain is top tier for Colorado, but not in the class of AltaBird, Whistler, Jackson, Squaw, Mammoth.

 

[EMSC]

Some mountains that have exceeded my expectations:
Mammoth CA - huge
Alpine Meadows CA - lots of semi -sidecountry terrain
Crested Butte CO - tons of steep stuff

Some areas that did not meet expectations:
Heavenly CA - beautiful runs, just awkward layout/traverses
Jackson Hole WY - too often wet snow/rain at the base, lower-half of the mountain often skunked, local macho attitude for 1-2 hr AM trams

The small portion of Chris C's list I disagree with.

Mammoth has a good reputation already, and I agree with it, so find it hard to be considered under rated
Alpine Meadows I find to be shorter vert and far too traverse ridden to live up to it's reputation of being pretty great. IMHO it's only good, not great.
Crested Butte is phenomenal when it's 100%; unfortunately it feels like it is super rare to ever get to 100%. Thus very rare to live up to its expectations.

Heavenly is most likely that fact that I worked there many moons ago. When you know a place like the back of your hand with as many acres - both in and outside official boundaries; you know where and when to hit all sorts of great stuff. I consider it to be under rated by most.

Jackson I've probably been lucky but have had some excellent March days for example despite the exposure. Yes it helps to be in the storm cycle, but the terrain is some of the best and it gets decent snow storms well into March most years.

I suppose I should add in more of my own resorts to the list(s), but don't really have time to think that through for a bit.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Heavenly is most likely that fact that I worked there many moons ago. When you know a place like the back of your hand with as many acres - both in and outside official boundaries; you know where and when to hit all sorts of great stuff. I consider it to be under rated by most.

Heavenly is a very interesting case, and one where I have extensive experience though much of it was during my first decade of skiing. I don't know whether it's underrated, but it's definitely subject to overuse due to its proximity to Tahoe's largest bed base. Inertia drives casual skier crowds to the place that's most convenient, especially when Heavenly is best known for its high altitude intermediate runs with fabulous views.

The awkward, catwalk intensive topography could be ameliorated by more intelligent lift placement, but none of Heavenly's owners have chosen to do that. What's amazing there and perhaps underrated is the widespread comfortable tree spacing. Heavenly does not get as much snow as the places on the Sierra Crest, but on a big powder day without lift shutdowns it's very impressive. And I have never skied the Firebreak slackcountry down to the casino base.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Monarch, CO: impressive how a ski area with less than 1,200 vertical feet and 600-ish acres can keep me entertained for two straight days (expert skiers' mileage may vary).

Silver Mountain, ID: I'd heard more about the base village and the T2B gondola than the ski area itself, so I didn't make a point of going on my first visit to the region. It turned out to be fun, decent-sized, and surprisingly old-school (nothing but old lifts).

Loveland, CO: before I started going there in the mid-00s, I was always turned off by its location -- "who wants to ski right alongside I-70 at the entrance to the tunnel?" -- however, that turned out to be a non-issue. It has a nice mix of cut trails through trees, open bowl skiing, and a non-destination ambiance.

Mary Jane, CO: Winter Park is a tale of two ski areas. The MJ side is really fun.

Snowbird, UT: excellent terrain and snow but the industrial ambiance ain't for me and it's gotten worse as an Ikon joint.

Sundance, UT: before going in 2005, I hadn't done my homework and wasn't expecting it to be an off-the-beaten-path local's area with surprisingly fun skiing.

St. Moritz, CH: I didn't bother going there for years due to the "only for rich people" reputation; however, you can do it affordably (way cheaper than U.S. variants) and the skiing (especially Corvatsch and Diavolezza) lives up to the hype.

Jungfrau, CH: it's tough to deny the industrial-tourism vibe, but the terrain, views, and villages are absolutely worth it. Skiing directly under the Eiger North Wall was breathtaking -- pix don't do it justice.

Isola, FR: I was pleasantly surprised by the terrain quality and snow preservation (it doesn't rain there during winter) -- shocking considering that it's only 30 miles from the Mediterranean.

Megève, FR: similar to St. Moritz, I was relieved to learn that the Aspen of France can be done affordably.

 

[Tony Crocker]

I took little impression away from Monarch. Adam and I were tired from a road marathon, leaving home Friday afternoon and skiing Arizona Snowbowl, Wolf Creek and Monarch the next 3 days. My brief notes mention morning corn on SE facing runs, but a cloudy afternoon prevented more widespread softening.

Mary Jane: I did not know James was a mogul aficionado...Oh, wait, he's from the Northeast! I don't seek out moguls, but I have no reason to doubt conventional wisdom that MJ's, carved by avid and competent mogul skiers with superb snow preservation, are the best. In 2015 we found Vail and Beaver Creek moguls to be of similar quality.

Isola, FR: I was pleasantly surprised by the terrain quality and snow preservation (it doesn't rain there during winter) -- shocking considering that it's only 30 miles from the Mediterranean.

It's counterintuitive but Fraser has explained for some time that the wet storms with high rain/snow line come from the Atlantic, not the Mediterranean. This also explains why St. Moritz is perhaps the most rain proof resort in the Alps.

Megève, FR: I think Fraser considers Megeve and Gstaad the most overrated Alps resorts due to low altitude and thus frequent rain and melt/freeze events. In January 2018 we drove through Megeve between Chamonix and Annecy and it looked like a refrozen mess, not surprising as it had rained to 6,000 feet a week before. Meanwhile we had been skiing above that level in the Monterosa, Cervinia and Chamonix.

 

[jimk]

Loveland is the CO Front Range “locals' hill” 90% of us flatlanders would kill to have as our home mountain.

 

[ChrisC]

Monarch, CO: impressive how a ski area with less than 1,200 vertical feet and 600-ish acres can keep me entertained for two straight days (expert skiers' mileage may vary).

I have only skied in January - great....do not know like it would be in March.

Silver Mountain, ID: I'd heard more about the base village and the T2B gondola than the ski area itself, so I didn't make a point of going on my first visit to the region. It turned out to be fun, decent-sized, and surprisingly old-school (nothing but old lifts).

Its a fun place.

Mary Jane, CO: Winter Park is a tale of two ski areas. The MJ side is really fun.

They should add another groomer or two to the mix. There is almost no one on the bumps of MJ.

Snowbird, UT: excellent terrain and snow but the industrial ambiance ain't for me and it's gotten worse as an Ikon joint.

Chamonix, St. Anton, Ischgl can be a bit industrial - but I still like them.

Sundance, UT: before going in 2005, I hadn't done my homework and wasn't expecting it to be an off-the-beaten-path local's area with surprisingly fun skiing.

I had a friend with a house in Sundance - it was a unique place.

St. Moritz, CH: I didn't bother going there for years due to the "only for rich people" reputation; however, you can do it affordably (way cheaper than U.S. variants) and the skiing (especially Corvatsch and Diavolezza) lives up to the hype.

I think you can avoid the worse by staying at Celerina or St Moritz Bad.

Jungfrau, CH: it's tough to deny the industrial-tourism vibe, but the terrain, views, and villages are absolutely worth it. Skiing directly under the Eiger North Wall was breathtaking -- pix don't do it justice.

Jungfrau - I don't think it's really overrun. Popular-yeas.

Isola, FR: I was pleasantly surprised by the terrain quality and snow preservation (it doesn't rain there during winter) -- shocking considering that it's only 30 miles from the Mediterranean.

Megève, FR: similar to St. Moritz, I was relieved to learn that the Aspen of France can be done affordably.

Megeve is best used as a storm day mountain. Les Houches. I fail to see the interest despite skiing 3 days in Megeve.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Monarch: I have only skied in January - great....do not know like it would be in March.

Here's what it looked like in early April last season.

Mary Jane: They should add another groomer or two to the mix.

Not sure if it's officially considered part of MJ; however, I include the terrain off the Panorama lift as part of that side of the mountain.

Megeve is best used as a storm day mountain.

That's how I experienced it in Feb 2016.

 

[EMSC]

Not a huge fan of Winter Park or even the MJ side. Generally poor lift layout, truly terrible access to the steeps (MJ Chutes, Cirque, Eagle Wind), some of the worst operational policies and decisions of any large resort IMHO, etc... The only thing that saves it really is that it gets good snow (better than much of central Colo) so surfaces are more often than not pretty good. Oh and thumbs up that you miss the 'joy' of dealing with the tunnels on I70 too. Overall meh for me. Others mileage may vary though, esp for non-experts.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Loveland is the CO Front Range “locals' hill” 90% of us flatlanders would kill to have as our home mountain.

Not me. If I were a passholder it would be highly aggravating waiting for the place to get decently covered by February. The wind is not a friend to Loveland. The upper ridge is so gradually pitched that snow does not stick to it well at all. On windy mountains you need steep leeward slopes to collect the snow, as Mammoth does extremely well like this October. Highlands Bowl seems to me a good example of this in Colorado.

I share EMSC's view of Winter Park, but I get that it's near the top of the heap for mogul bashers.

 

[nathanvg]

Great topic... One caveat, even my disappointing destinations have been a lot of fun. I also noticed a trend which is that the disappointments relate to personal preference so others may like different things. In particular, I value longer descents, low crowds, fast groomers, challenging steeps and great scenery.

***Disappointments***
Big Sky: Based on 6k acres, 4.4k vert and a great reputation I expected a lot. As other have said, the tram is a disaster due to long lines and without the tram the vertical for most runs is between 1k and 1.5k. Most of those short runs are pretty flat. Challenger was the only non-tram challenging steeps area. Shedhorn, dakota and t-wolf had good runs but nothing special. I'd like to explore more of the technically challenging stuff off the tram and challenger and will probably return but might not if they don't fix the tram issue.

Mammoth: Another area with good top line stats and reputation but didn't live up to my interests. The top 500 vertical feet off the gondola/23 is very cool but most of the rest is mostly flat run out or very short pitches. I visited in April and everything east of roller coaster was closed so lifts 22 and 9 would help if I visit again. I also found the lift management to be annoying. For example, they ran three redundant lifts (1, 6 and gondola) when I would have much preferred they ran the gondola and a closed lift like 14, 9 or 22. 14 for example was open to ski but you had to hike out. They also had roller coaster open but didn't want you to ski it except to get to the parking which was very odd.

Europe: As an American, I heard a lot about how cool European skiing was and when I unexpectedly relocated to Europe for a few years, I had high expectations. I recall numerous lift ride conversations with Europeans about how they much preferred N American skiing that initially surprised me but I came to understand as "grass is greener on the other side" phenomenon. (both ways) The towns are neat and the mountains big but snow is more rare/wet, crowds can be nuts, anything challenging is not avalanche controlled, topography is often short steeps followed by flats, lower vertical is often not worth skiing, etc. I recommend everyone ski the alps once because they are different but I'm firmly a N American ski fan.

***Good Surprises***
Scotland: I wasn't expecting much skiing at Cairngorm but with 2k vert and decent snow (not something you can count on every year) it was a lot of fun. To be clear, Scottish skiing is far inferior to other regions but it can still be a lot of fun. I also find that I enjoy the people more at these rustic ski areas. People tend to be passionate about skiing and making the most of what they have. They're not going shopping, showing off fur coats, expecting a butler to help them, etc.

AZ Snowbowl: I was in town for business and squeezed in a weekday of skiing. I was one of a few dozen people skiing 8" of powder. It was great.

Mt. Rose: I had overlooked this ski area on past Tahoe trips but was glad I made it. The high elevation made for great snow quality and the runs fit my tastes great. Several steep sustained groomers served by high speed lifts, top level steeps in the chutes area, and a nice mix of other run types. 1.3k vert was low but the runs generally did not have a run out so it felt longer.