Mammoth, April 29-30, 2025

[Tony Crocker]

I should have known when Tseeb declined my invitation to join us at Mammoth that we might get a primo corn day. This has happened 3x before.

We got out at 8:30 Tuesday morning to clear skies and a solid overnight freeze. What got my attention first was a race course starting at the top of Cornice Bowl.

I have seen courses set about 1/3 of the way up many times but this is the first time from the top. This was for the US Men’s Ski Team. We thought we would check that out later but they were done at 9:15.

The first run on Stump Alley was already in corn mode at the bottom. A second exploratory run around to the lower race courses had corn on Rusty’s but firmly frozen above and on Broadway, We returned to Stump for 2 runs of ideal corn top to bottom a little before 9AM.

We skied Face of 3 and Coyote to chair 5. There was another race course set on the lower half of Solitude but the rest of Solitude was butter smooth. This is when I realized what kind of a day this would be. Usually skier traffic chews up Solitude before the ideal corn stage, but not on Tuesday. With the lower crowds we hit Solitude 3x for perfect corn. This is the run where both Garry Klassen and I have had collision injuries and for which the local unofficial name is "Multitude."

Next we took the gondola to the top to check out the US Ski team route. Cornice was good but we could see that Gremlin’s and World Cup were still hard. So we reran the chair 3, Coyote, chair 5, Solitude circuit one more time. I tested Climax, which had the 3 inches new from last weekend irregularly spread over the old base and was a lot of work.

We hit Cornice the second time around 10:30. Even though Gremlin’s/World Cup/St.Anton had been open to the public over an hour, so few people had skied it that it was all butter smooth corn. We ran 3 more perfect corn laps via chairs 1 and 23, meeting Garry after the second one. Most of the chair 23 runs had similar snow as Climax and were not being skied, cutting down the number of skiers dropping into lower St. Anton.

Riding chair 23 The Hulk remains unchanged for a decade now but this year’s new action figure El Chapulin Colorado looks bent over from the weather since December.

Viewed from the top of 23, the White Mountains in the distance looked covered from this weekend’s storm despite being almost bare April 9-10 and Mammoth getting only 2-3 inches.

Scotty’s noon – 1PM had excellent corn after recent grooming, as did the lower race courses after the racers were done.

At 1:30 I rode the gondola to check out Dave’s, which was similar to Climax though late in the day the subsurface was softer. I barely made it to chair 5 before 2PM closing. Groomed Sanctuary looked bulletproof when we were riding 5 in the morning. But at 2PM it served up a grand finale of the day’s perfect corn. Again this was due to the low crowd. On April 9-10 this groomed area was skied far too much before it softened and thus had bumps and clumps when it did.

My total vertical was 31,400. Liz skied 30,300, which is the most since her knee replacement and one of maybe five 30K+ days since we met 14 years ago.

At the end of the day we often see Kirk AKA Mountain Monster tailgating in the chair 2 parking lot with his dog. He said Tuesday was Mammoth's best ski day of the past 3 weeks.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Clouds moved in Tuesday night. Wednesday vs. Tuesday was a textbook example of the clouds drastically minimizing the overnight freeze. In this scenario crowds will degrade the snow very quickly, but fortunately Wednesday was even quieter than Tuesday. The morning was mostly cloudy with a sunny break around 11AM.

The Cornice/World Cup/Gremlin’s/St. Anton route was not being used at all by racers Wednesday.

We started with 2 Stump Alley runs because it was fully in corn mode at 8:30. The exploratory run to chair 1 revealed only slightly firm snow in places that were solid frozen granular at the same time Tuesday. We rode chair 3 and skied Coyote, also fully in corn mode by 9AM.

At the top of chair 5, Solitude was roped off all the way up because that’s where the US Men’s Ski Team was training Wednesday.

Here is the gadget they use to mark the blue lines on race courses, with the blue refill material hanging on the pole at left.

We got some action shots halfway down the course.

I shot some video but it’s of marginal quality; I might get around to an edit sometime.

We moved on to the Cornice/World Cup/Gremlin’s/St. Anton route by 10:30AM. It was very good but not the perfection of Tuesday. Garry, then Liz on Cornice:

We skied Andy’s, then back up 23 to Scotty’s. I ventured into Monument.

It was smoother than Climax or Dave’s, so I should have skied it Tuesday. The upper steep part was supportable Wednesday, but about halfway down the snow got heavier and I bailed to Scotty’s, which was excellent.

We rode the gondola, arriving up top at noon. We heard some employees mentioning lightning, which generally means all lifts close for at least half an hour. Skiing down we saw chair 23 had closed but nothing else so Garry and I went up 3.

At noon the snow nearly everywhere was heavy. We skied to Triangle, where the adequately steep pitch overcame the stickiness. We navigated down past chair 5 carefully, and fortunately the trail under Rodger’s Ridge had not been skied much so we got back to the chair 2 parking without difficulty.

I still managed 20,900 vertical of mostly high quality skiing. But the day was over by 12:30. It started raining at 1:15 just as we were leaving town.

 

[EMSC]

Hard to tell if they were working on DH or SG, but definitely working on speed events.

Here is the gadget they use to mark the blue lines on race courses, with the blue refill material hanging on the pole at left.

Actually, no. Typical is simple blue dye mixed with water (in a top/base lodge somewhere) in a pressure container and small hand held spray wand. That contraption looks to me like a salt spreader. Load salt in the top and the motor sprays out the salt far enough to spread it around more or less evenly(ish) 20-30 feet away from the 'nozzle'.

Typical dye method:

 

[Tony Crocker]

Mammoth salts groomers a lot, but usually starting in May. The salt is sprayed our the back of a snowcat in by a fan nozzle to spread it out horizontally. That salt is white not blue.

I'm sure the US Ski Team has exact requirements of what they want, and maybe that could be a different type of salt and precise spraying by hand.

However, we took those 4 corn laps Tuesday on the path they had used for DH/SG training before 9:15 and it seemed exactly the same as I have skied many times in late season after the racers are done. It was better than most of those other times, but I attribute that to abnormally low skier traffic. Routine low skier traffic is one of the reasons Bachelor's corn skiing is the most consistent in my experience.

 

[EMSC]

That salt is white not blue.

Just the bag they put it in is blue for that salt. If you look at the bag itself in your pic it is "Sure Soft Water Softener Extra Coarse Salt". I'll bet there are pallet loads of those 40lb bags somewhere in the base of Mammoth. Also looks like the spreader is a slightly modified fertilizer spreader.

Possible they were not salting at all on the day(s) you were skiing but had things ready to go just in case. But that's what that particular gear is used for. In my experience every day can be different in spring as to salt or no salt (at least until you hit a certain point in the spring). It may be that Mammoth itself refuses to salt yet so the US team is doing minor by-hand stuff until the mountain takes over sometime in May...

 

[Tony Crocker]

my experience every day can be different in spring as to salt or no salt (at least until you hit a certain point in the spring).

That is definitely the way Mammoth looks at it. It depends upon the daily conditions whether they salt.

 

[Sbooker]

I've really got to experience this genuine spring skiing in Mammoth.
@Tony Crocker If decent skiing is done by say 1pm are there safe (avalanche) hiking trails within a reasonable drive of Mammoth Lakes at that time of year? Hanging around a hotel or drinking at a pub all afternoon is not my idea of an acceptable use of time. I would be bored in about 10 minutes.
I can see me breaking my semi serious USA/Trump boycott due to the 13 hour non stop flight being much much easier to handle that the 24 hour with a stop flight to Europe. Vancouver/Whistler is also ok but it probably costlier. Pity there is no genuine late April/early May skiing options in Japan.

 

[spinbackwards]

Corn is something that's difficult if not impossible to describe to someone who's...never skied it. But it's good. When I get proper corn I always feel as if I should buy a lottery ticket.

I'll add that unless you ski in the spring, you're not going to get corn. Corn is a reward for hard core types like yours truly and Tony, who ski well into May or June.

 

[Skieric]

Corn snow can be fun. It happens when the snow repeatedly softens daytime and refreezes at night. It takes a few days of this cycle to get form properly. It is never the first day or 2 of the warmup. I start to find corn snow from late March and on. The snow takes on a unique fluidity. There is no ice or firm, its not slushy. However its definitely heavier than powder.

 

[Tony Crocker]

When I get proper corn I always feel as if I should buy a lottery ticket.

It's probably harder to come by in Colorado lift service in terms of the combination of weather and low skier density. I'd guess the backcountry off the 12,000 foot high passes in May/June might be a good bet.

There is no question in my mind that Bachelor is the highest frequency place for elite all day long lift served corn. Yet when sbooker was there in April 2023 it was winter not spring. That was also true the first two times I took Liz there in May 2014 and late April 2018. So in 2021 and this year we made the call to go there within a week based upon weather forecasts.

Mammoth's climate is overall probably more consistent for corn than Bachelor. But skier density is higher. There are a lot of days where you get perfect corn for a couple of runs here and there (mornings on chairs 9 and 25, early afternoon chair 14, race courses after the rope drops). But the days where you get it all day like Tuesday or when the upper steeps have smooth corn are less frequent than at Bachelor.

I'll add that unless you ski in the spring, you're not going to get corn.

Not true! That afternoon at Porters was comparable to some at Mammoth or Bachelor, though I know I was very lucky to hit the weather sequence that produced it. I also skied corn on Alpine Meadows' south facing Sherwood on the winter solstice once. Baldy sidecountry can yield corn anytime, but of course you need a deep snowpack which it doesn't have very often.

However its definitely heavier than powder.

At its peak I definitely disagree. Ideal corn is the least resistant ski surface I can imagine, and I have skied a LOT of it in the past 2 weeks.

 

[Sbooker]

Corn is something that's difficult if not impossible to describe to someone who's...never skied it. But it's good. When I get proper corn I always feel as if I should buy a lottery ticket.

I'll add that unless you ski in the spring, you're not going to get corn. Corn is a reward for hard core types like yours truly and Tony, who ski well into May or June.

I’ve had it a few times but not at Mammoth. But I’ve been stymied by powder in April a few times too.

 

[Skieric]

At its peak I definitely disagree. Ideal corn is the least resistant ski surface I can imagine, and I have skied a LOT of it in the past 2 weeks.

Could that perhaps have to do with skiing 60-100 days in the last 6 months and therefore you are in optimal condition? I have seen skiers who are out of condition struggle in corn snow especially when it was moved around a lot by skier traffic.

 

[Tony Crocker]

especially when it was moved around a lot by skier traffic.

I have said several times that low skier density is a key element in the development of the smooth low resistance ideal corn condition. I think it would be once in a blue moon that a groomed run in the Northeast would be left undisturbed long enough in spring for that smooth uniform surface to develop. Maybe a run roped off for race training?

I have seen skiers who are out of condition struggle in corn snow

That isn't true corn snow by my standards. That's why in my previous post I mentioned that often at Mammoth the smooth corn only lasts for a couple of runs before skier traffic starts carving it up, leaving clumps and irregularities requiring more effort and precision to ski.

The ideal corn surface is as smooth and less resistant than freshly groomed packed powder.

Could that perhaps have to do with skiing 60-100 days in the last 6 months and therefore you are in optimal condition?

I am at 44 days and Liz at 42. Tuesday was my highest vertical day of the season despite the mountain closing at 2PM and was Liz' highest vertical day in several years. That's ample evidence of how little effort is needed with these snow conditions.

Five of my nine lifetime days over 40K have been in April, three of those at Bachelor and the other two at Mammoth. That's not coincidental.

 

[spinbackwards]

It's probably harder to come by in Colorado lift service in terms of the combination of weather and low skier density. I'd guess the backcountry off the 12,000 foot high passes in May/June might be a good bet.

There is no question in my mind that Bachelor is the highest frequency place for elite all day long lift served corn. Yet when sbooker was there in April 2023 it was winter not spring. That was also true the first two times I took Liz there in May 2014 and late April 2018. So in 2021 and this year we made the call to go there within a week based upon weather forecasts.

Mammoth's climate is overall probably more consistent for corn than Bachelor. But skier density is higher. There are a lot of days where you get perfect corn for a couple of runs here and there (mornings on chairs 9 and 25, early afternoon chair 14, race courses after the rope drops). But the days where you get it all day like Tuesday or when the upper steeps have smooth corn are less frequent than at Bachelor.

Not true! That afternoon at Porters was comparable to some at Mammoth or Bachelor, though I know I was very lucky to hit the weather sequence that produced it. I also skied corn on Alpine Meadows' south facing Sherwood on the winter solstice once. Baldy sidecountry can yield corn anytime, but of course you need a deep snowpack which it doesn't have very often.

At its peak I definitely disagree. Ideal corn is the least resistant ski surface I can imagine, and I have skied a LOT of it in the past 2 weeks.

My comments are in the context of CO. I never ski anywhere else.

That said, I stand by my comments that most skiers will never experience corn.
Because...

1. They don't ski in the Spring
Yeah sure, we can have warm days in the Winter - defined as December through February. But that's rare. And again, a skier would have to be lucky to be skiing on that "rare" warm day.

Here in CO, corn season window opens when there's more chances of the temperature being above 38 degrees -- that's mid-March. But by mid-March most skiers have moved on. If they live in Denver they're riding bikes, playing golf, or going to the park.

2. They don't ski enough
In CO, corn happens when the over night frozen snow warms up to around 40ish degrees, but not too warm for beginning slush -- 45ish degrees. Again, this is reserved for the Spring. There's a window. Most times that window shuts fast. Either because it warms up to over 45 degrees, or the temperature drops.
I'm at 50 days so far this year. Very few ski this much. Last weekend the top part of North Pole was corn category, but then the lower part was beginning slush. I recall a weekday day at Beaver Creek in March when a corn window opened. Not many can ski during the week.

Last year I hiked Highland Bowl and got corn on the top 2/3 of Full Curl. I believe it was a weekday. And I had to hike the bowl to get it. Few skiers are going to hit that combination - weekday skiing and hiking the bowl.

So again, corn is a rarity. I'm happy to get it.

 

[Sbooker]

How does Whistler Blackcomb rate for spring skiing?

 

[Tony Crocker]

How does Whistler Blackcomb rate for spring skiing?

I have been there twice in early April with predominantly winter conditions in the alpine.

Whistler resembles Mammoth and Bachelor in terms of the deep coastal snowpack, high altitude relative to latitude (important for overnight freezing in spring) and an extended season well into May. However, I strongly suspect that Whistler is much cloudier than Mammoth or Bachelor because it's much closer to the Pacific. Clouds are bad because they inhibit overnight freezing and if it's cold enough to freeze, it might not get warm enough during the day to produce corn. The key criteria are:
1) overnight freeze
2) low skier density
3) clear skies during the day, and more relevant for perhaps 3-5 days prior to settle the snow. Grooming speeds up the process so you can get corn in 1-2 days, but finding groomers with low enough skier density is a challenge and near to impossible in ski areas with shrunken spring operations.

That said, I stand by my comments that most skiers will never experience corn.

I suspect this is true for the vast majority of Northeast skiers. The chronic high humidity limits the required temperature swing between an overnight freeze and warm enough daytime temperatures. Skieric is not the first eastern skier to make a telltale remark like:

I have seen skiers who are out of condition struggle in corn snow especially when it was moved around a lot by skier traffic.

To me that's a red flag that he has never experienced the corn snow as described in this TR and thread.

In Front Range Colorado and Utah's Cottonwood Canyons there is a different issue. Snowfall in April is frequent enough that there is often not enough time between storms for that 3-5 day settling out period. Once you get much into May you usually have only A-Basin and Snowbird open, and both have so few groomers that there is virtually no chance of groomer corn due to skier density, and you are dependent upon the much more fickle sequence of weather required for ungroomed corn.

Jimmy Petterson says in the Alps, nearly all of the corn he skis is on groomers. Easily accessible off-piste is chewed up so much when it's fresh powder that it takes along time to settle out. I've seen it take a month at Baldy. The scale of many resorts in the Alps results in some groomed runs being very low skier density. In late March/early April 2022 I got high quality groomer corn in Orelle, Rifflsee and Veysonnaz. I'd be interested to know if James has experienced this on any of his March trips, as he is fanatical about seeking areas with low skier density. If so I'd also be interested if he's ever seen that type of snow in the Northeast.

In Oregon and especially California, average April snowfall is much lower than in the winter months, unlike Utah and Colorado. This is a positive for corn formation. Tahoe, particularly Palisades and Alpine Meadows, have good reputations for corn. Due to the big elevation difference, potential corn season runs about a month earlier there than at Mammoth. But if you get it there in March, skier density will likely be an impediment. I have no doubt that there are some March/April days where Palisades' extensive steeps get corn snow that makes that technical skiing much more forgiving. But you need to get lucky with the weather sequence, as I have for a few standout days at Mammoth in May and June. By May I suspect good overnight freezes at Palisades/Alpine are infrequent.