Request for advice: first time visit to Vail

[Lewis1000]

Hi folks,
Our family will be skiing Vail for one day this weekend (stopping on our way to Snowmass). This will be our first visit. We are all excellent skiers. If left to ourselves, we'd be inclined to just head for the bowls but we're wondering given the weather and conditions if anyone could suggest a more intelligent strategy?

Thanks for the help
Steve

 

[ericmorton]

I don't necessarily have a better strategy than "head for the bowls", but if the conditions on Blue Sky Basin warrant it, hit that more than the south facing back bowls. Lover's Leap had some great snow on it. Most of all, bring your own meat and a bottle of wine and grill at the Belle's camp. That actually stands out as our best day at Vail.

On the frontside, conditions can be fun underneath the Vista Bahn lift.

Be ready for the sheer size of the place. China bowl is bigger than most ski resorts are. They can run 16-20 snowcats in a line up China Bowl and barely cover 10% of the main path.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Blue Sky and the front side should have enough north facing winter snow to keep you busy until the bowls soften, most of the time. If it's really warm you may be on groomers for a couple of hours while the ungroomed is still firm. The steep trees at the very top of Blue Sky were the last refuge of winter snow on a warm week last April.

 

[EMSC]

I'm guessing that temps will be so warm this weekend that it'll all be spring conditions based on the Denver area forecast, but best bets for any possibility of winter snow would be the steep trees in Blue Sky, or some of the steeps up top on the front side - Northwoods cliffs or maybe Highline. Looking like late April temps this weekend last I saw...

 

[rfarren]

At this time of year the back bowls aren't where it's at. I much prefer Blue Sky Basin. Not merely is the terrain there steeper, but it faces north! The trees there are wonderful. Also the back bowls could be ridiculously bad if it was warm the day before and snows the next but doesn't get more than 12 inches, you'll be hitting frozen bumps all over the place.

 

[johnnash]

We're going to be skiing Summit/ Eagle the next 3 days -- could be Vail, Breck, BC, or A-basin. Any advice other than what's already been posted about Vail? At this point, I know we're not going to find powder -- packed or otherwise -- anywhere, but I just wonder if some areas of these resorts are less susceptible to the thaw-freeze cycle. As I understand the other posts, Blue Sky is a good bet; are there others? Thanks for any advice!

 

[yak]

Enjoy a nice long breakfast. The rule with the bowls is to let 'em bake a bit in the sun after the previous night's freeze. +-10:30 works as a good rule of thumb. Later if it's slightly cloudy. Follow the sun around the aspects that are just thawing out as the day progresses, and you'll have nice corn.

Runs like Forever are going to be baking in the afternoon - find your rhythm for a thousand or so turns down the falline. 8)

Of course, it it's cloudy enough to prevent the bake, or there's a lot of wind, things may not soften up as quickly (or at all, depending on aspect).

Have fun!

 

[Marc_C]

I know we're not going to find powder -- packed or otherwise -- anywhere, but I just wonder if some areas of these resorts are less susceptible to the thaw-freeze cycle.

At Western areas, in general, no, since the spring freeze-thaw cycle is primarily temperature dependent, not aspect. Yes, very sheltered areas - read: trees - may be a little less susceptible, but mostly in taking longer to soften. Clear nights will generally produce a firmer freeze - if temperatures are low enough - but remember the isothermal properties of the snowpack; you don't need temps in the 20's to produce a coral reef the next morning. The thermal mass of the snowpack can do that all on its own at 33F, given a clear night. There's also such a thing as too much softening - when the snowpack becomes unsupportable, bottomless sand. The best skiing is usually within a 2+ hr window for a given aspect.

 

[Tony Crocker]

I was in Summit/Eagle the first week of April last year and I found winter conditions to be as much a function of altitude as exposure. The dividing line was ~11,500 feet that week. So essentially all spring at Vail, majority winter at A-Basin and Loveland. Breck's Imperial Bowl and Whale's Tail were excellent. Of course Whale's Tail and Pallavicini are steep and north facing as well as high.

And be warned A-Basin and Loveland are still low tide and only 70% open this year, while all of these areas had very deep snowpacks when I was there a year ago. A deep snowpack has a well below freezing refrigerated core. The melt/freeze can happen faster with a thinner snowpack.

when the snowpack becomes unsupportable, bottomless sand

That's an isothermic snowpack when the refrigerated core is gone, as explained to me by the late Jack Mason at Winter Park in 2002, the last time that region had as thin a spring snowpack as it will probably have this year.