Where To Ski with Comped Lodging?

[Tony Crocker]

I'd add Telluride to that list, even more so than Steamboat.

I would agree that Telluride is overall better as a destination. From reading Harvey44's trip reports over the years, I think Steamboat in January is most likely a near perfect fit in terms of snow/terrain. Telluride vs. Beaver Creek? Beaver Creek gets more snow, terrain is a better fit (Telluride is still somewhat stratified, lower proportion true intermediate than most places), probably more bang in luxury lodging for his freebie. Telluride is clear cut better on the aesthetics/scenery, best in Colorado for that.

James pretty much nailed it on admin. If he can't be pried out of Alta to a less busy Utah area on a delayed road-opening powder day, there's no chance he'll be lured 5 hours away. The other point is that he doesn't get a lot of vacation time, and in that situation I too would be inclined to cherry-pick those one powder day at a time vs. an advance committed trip somewhere.

For those with more time, I'm less inclined to generalize. After all, I've been snowcat skiing with a bunch of SLC locals at Chatter Creek the past 3 years. Another example is Ron Cram of http://skistreak.com, who lives in the SLC area but also does quite a bit of ski travel.

 

[Geoff]

Beaver Creek
Breckenridge
Copper Mountain
Deer Valley
Jackson Hole
Steamboat
Stowe
Sun Valley
Tahoe
Telluride

However the timing of this trip coincides roughly with my wife's 40th birthday. In order to convince her not to choose one of the other available destinations (Paris), she'd have to believe that there would be entertainment for a wife on a big birthday and a four year old.

What do you think? What's the best choice in your opinion?

The people here are nuts. You're going to propose sending a wife with a major birthday and a 4 year old to Jackson Hole for a week? That's going to get the fastest veto you ever saw. Enjoy Paris. You can get high speed rail to the French Alps. Gare de Lyon to Bourg St Mourice is like 4 1/2 hours by TGV.

 

[Marc_C]

James pretty much nailed it on admin. If he can't be pried out of Alta to a less busy Utah area on a delayed road-opening powder day, there's no chance he'll be lured 5 hours away.

He's not the only one. I've not skied outside of Utah since moving here in late 2000. I don't even make it all the way up to Snowbasin that often (I have an extra 30 minute drive compared to Admin). However, we have spent a 4th of July weekend in Teluride, a Pioneer Day long weekend in Glacier NP, a few weekends in Vegas, a Labor Day weekend in Boulder when we picked up one of our cats from a breeder (came back thru Steamboat), and several summer weekends (including another Jul 4th) in Jackson.

Drive 5+ hrs for skiing when I would be able to almost see Tram tower 4 from my kitchen window if it weren't for the ridge that separates LCC from Bell Canyon? Please. As if!

 

[Marc_C]

...In order to convince her not to choose one of the other available destinations (Paris), she'd have to believe that there would be entertainment for a wife on a big birthday and a four year old.

The people here are nuts. You're going to propose sending a wife with a major birthday and a 4 year old to Jackson Hole for a week? That's going to get the fastest veto you ever saw. Enjoy Paris.

It really depends on the person and whether they're self-sufficient in finding entertainment or need everything planned and dished up for them.
BTW, I thought Paris sucked.

 

[Tony Crocker]

...Enjoy Paris. You can get high speed rail to the French Alps. Gare de Lyon to Bourg St Mourice is like 4 1/2 hours by TGV.

Finally another voice of reason on this thread. In answering Harvey44's question, we should view Paris as the alternative. While day-commuting from there to ski is impractical, it might be worth Harvey44's trouble to investigate the possibility of using the freebie for a week in Paris, then taking another week on his own dime in a French Alp resort. On the other hand Paris is probably a less desirable destination than a ski resort for a 4-year-old.

Harvey does need to respond to our questions (timing, wife's preferences) before we can offer any better advice than we've done already.

 

[Patrick]

...Enjoy Paris. You can get high speed rail to the French Alps. Gare de Lyon to Bourg St Mourice is like 4 1/2 hours by TGV.

I didn't mention it, because it wasn't in the list but if you're willing be away from the wife and child for a longer period, this would make perfect sense. However not sure how the wife would like the fact that you're 1/2 across the country.

TGV to Bourg St-Maurice then funiculaire to Les Arcs. No car needed

On the other hand Paris is probably a less desirable destination than a ski resort for a 4-year-old.

We visited Amsterdam/Rotterdam in the Winter rain went Morgane was 3. Saw London twice with the girls (Morgane at 9months and 5 yo + Tara at 4 months). Not taking about Toronto or other big cities when the kids were young.

Big cities are great with young kids, Paris would be too. Instead of visiting Le Louvre museum (hard to kids that can walk and want to move), you go to children/science museums, city parks, zoos.

BTW, I thought Paris sucked.

Why am I not surprise by this statement. :roll:

 

[Admin]

SLC is not a big city, hence it's absence on either list! (Plus, I live in the Salt Lake Valley, not SLC proper.)

Neither is Quebec, but it made your list. I'm guessing it's about the same size as SLC.

 

[Marc_C]

SLC is not a big city, hence it's absence on either list! (Plus, I live in the Salt Lake Valley, not SLC proper.)

Neither is Quebec, but it made your list. I'm guessing it's about the same size as SLC.

OK. Somehow it felt bigger. Obviously that pushes it even more in a negative direction. (Although we did like staying at the Frantenec and the surrounding neighborhood.)

 

[Harvey]

Wow - fun thread. Most fun one I ever started. I still don't know how to put multiple quotes in on post so I did some cutting and pasting:

That said, I'd like to commend Harvey for the very unique thread title.

If you're so smart how come you're not rich?

This is a classic example of responders projecting their own preferences on someone else's question. Harvey44 skis all the time at Gore, on teles, and finds it challenging. How much of JH will he enjoy skiing? How much of JH will his wife enjoy skiing? One diversion that Harvey44 and family would likely enjoy a lot is the snowcat daytrip into Yellowstone.

Gotta respect the customized advice. Not sure about the snowcat. If I'm going to do anything offslope on a trip like this...it would have to be to gain wife points. Not sure that is it.

First obvious question: When is the birthday, and must the trip coincide with it? If it's in January Jackson and Steamboat would be top picks for "great conditions and new snow." If it's in March I wouldn't go near either of those due to the south exposure. Telluride would be a good March choice.

The timing of the birthday is a little irrelevant. (It's July - and the trip must be used by June 1). Since our daughter was born we haven't traveled by plane on vacation. The travel is not easy with a child and we can't afford easily afford it either. (We did ski Switzerland and visit Tuscany in the year before she was born.)

Point is we aren't taking more than one expensive trip in a year. Lodging is comped but the trip would still cost a lot - for us. I'm guessing if you do a week in Jackson Hole, with eating and lift tix, gear rental and airfare...it's going to be cost some real money. Whatever we do...that would be her birthday trip. If it's January in Steamboat because of south facing slopes...that's what it is.

If your wife wants to go to Paris, why not compromise?.... What about Chamonix, St. Moritz, or another nice european destination where one can fulfill the cultural aspects as well as the skiing?

If I do go to Paris...it will be for my wife's birthday, not to ski. Paris...without skiing...could be the cheapest option. Maybe Stowe with skiing would be cheaper than Paris without...not sure.

...well, Harvey would have a blast anywhere. :lol:

Patrick...you da man. Anywhere with skiing.

The people here are nuts. You're going to propose sending a wife with a major birthday and a 4 year old to Jackson Hole for a week? That's going to get the fastest veto you ever saw.

On a regular basis, Geoff's input is based more solidily in reality than anyone else on FTO, myself included.

...it might be worth Harvey44's trouble to investigate the possibility of using the freebie for a week in Paris, then taking another week on his own dime in a French Alp resort.

Tony...you were doing so well..doing what you do best. And I was looking to you for all that Steamboat = South Facing = Jan type stuff. That's your wheelhouse. There's no question in my mind that you are an incredible resource for FTO. We are lucky to have you. But maybe you should stay away from the attempts to estimate what reality is like for the other humans.

 

[Marc_C]

There's no question in my mind that you are an incredible resource for FTO. We are lucky to have you. But maybe you should stay away from the attempts to estimate what reality is like for the other humans.

Best. Post. Ever.
\/

 

[jamesdeluxe]

You guys are used to 5 - 7 hr drives, so you don't understand why we don't go to JH (and spend $$$ on lodging, food, gas, etc)... Driving 5+ hrs to ski - been there, done that....a lot; don't need to now. It really shouldn't be hard to understand.

I wish I knew why you keep going back to that overgrazed parcel of land... no one's questioning why you ski most of the time at a (world-class) mountain where you have a season pass. I'd do the same thing.

The reason I brought up Admin with the pipe and slippers comment (and not you) is that he's in a slightly different position from the rest of the SLC crew. In addition to skiing locally, he can play the Ski Industry Bigwig® card and enjoy a junket or two a season to an interesting destination... if nothing other than to break things up and to try something different. When asked why he doesn't do that, he's told us a gazillion times that he doesn't get bored skiing at Altabird over and over. Fair enough. For some people, familiarity breeds boredom; for others, familiarity makes them feel warm and fuzzy.

 

[Admin]

"Now, where did I leave that 'warm and fuzzy' emoticon...?"

 

[Tony Crocker]

Not sure about the snowcat.

This is not snowcat skiing. It's visiting Yellowstone thermal sites and scenery in winter, a great one-day family diversion IMHO. The buffalo herds also congregate on/near the roads/thermal areas in winter.

then taking another week on his own dime in a French Alp resort.

I have often read that you can rent apartments cheap in some French Alp resorts. The Brits run a lot of cheap deals into the French Alps. I'll defer to Patrick as he knows more than I about:
1) Skiing in France, and
2) Scoring cheap lodging

I didn't say that this was the best option; I just said it's worth investigating if your wife really wants to go to Paris. It's always worth brainstorming the possibilities. You've already spent the airfare to get over there. Marginal cost of adding on a ski week might not be that much. If it turns out to be too expensive, it hasn't cost you anything more than a couple of hours of your time to check it out.

The time flexibility makes Steamboat more attractive. You still haven't said what your wife's top priorities for this trip are. Does she ski the same type of snow/terrain as you? What type of resort would she like? Would the upscale atmosphere of Beaver Creek attract her more than the more rustic/natural beauty of a place like Jackson? Telluride probably splits the difference here. If the resort is most important, I agree with admin that these 3 are all better than Steamboat. But Steamboat is clearly the best ski fit for you (powder, trees, intermediate to advanced intermediate pitch) and perhaps your wife too.

The reason I brought up Admin with the pipe and slippers comment (and not you) is that he's in a slightly different position from the rest of the SLC crew.

This is the part I do understand. Admin has limited vacation time, and since he's powder-centric he'll get more freshies on short-notice daytrips that on a destination week anywhere. Unless he can score a week in the heli, and I'm not sure even admin is that high on the ski journalism food chain. :wink: My critiques of admin's ski decisions are within Utah. I like BobbyD's powder calls better.

Wow - fun thread. Most fun one I ever started.

Part of the reason to change the topic heading. When someone wants to search/look this up in couple of years, it's going to be a lot harder to find if it's just a generic "Where to Ski."

 

[Geoff]

On a regular basis, Geoff's input is based more solidily in reality than anyone else on FTO, myself included.

With the added data of "limited budget" and "before June 1", I'd be more prone to point you at Tuscany if you have a comp place to stay. The weather will be warmer starting in mid-March. Costs lower. You probably want to rent a cheap microscopic car at least part of the time. I've been in that part of the world recently. Lucignano in a restored 17th century farmhouse on 20 acres wouldn't suck. You're really close to Siena. Florence isn't all that far. I'd web search to find cheap flights to Rome, a cheap car at the airport in Rome for the week, and do that trip. Just beg, borrow, or steal a GPS with a European database in it before you go.

 

[Tony Crocker]

With the added data of "limited budget" and "before June 1", I'd be more prone to point you at Tuscany if you have a comp place to stay.

Another worthy suggestion. But fly into Milan. You have enticing ski options there too, as March is on average the optimal month to ski in the Alps. :wink: My friend Richard did a similar trip around Easter I think a few years ago. He spent a week in the Alps (St. Moritz) then visited his daughter who was in grad school in Florence and spent a couple of weeks touring Italy.

For some people, familiarity breeds boredom; for others, familiarity makes them feel warm and fuzzy.

Patrick and I are probably at the extreme end of the spectrum in craving variety. No ski season is complete for me without trying at least a couple of new places. I'm the same way within a ski area, rarely skiing the same run multiple times within a day if I can avoid it. Powder is what overrides this mindset. If the same stash remains relatively untracked I'll continue to work it over. I suspect if I lived in SLC I'd devote at least the first couple of seasons to maximizing powder. But after that I would probably allot some part of each season to travel and trying new places.

 

[Geoff]

With the added data of "limited budget" and "before June 1", I'd be more prone to point you at Tuscany if you have a comp place to stay.

Another worthy suggestion. But fly into Milan. You have enticing ski options there too, as March is on average the optimal month to ski in the Alps. :wink: My friend Richard did a similar trip around Easter I think a few years ago. He spent a week in the Alps (St. Moritz) then visited his daughter who was in grad school in Florence and spent a couple of weeks touring Italy.

For some people, familiarity breeds boredom; for others, familiarity makes them feel warm and fuzzy.

Patrick and I are probably at the extreme end of the spectrum in craving variety. No ski season is complete for me without trying at least a couple of new places. I'm the same way within a ski area, rarely skiing the same run multiple times within a day if I can avoid it. Powder is what overrides this mindset. If the same stash remains relatively untracked I'll continue to work it over. I suspect if I lived in SLC I'd devote at least the first couple of seasons to maximizing powder. But after that I would probably allot some part of each season to travel and trying new places.

Yep. Milan also probably has nonstop flights from JFK. If you're going to connect through a European hub, Venice is also close to skiing and is a better touron stop in March.

I'm at the far other end of the spectrum on hanging out at one ski area. I'm where I am because of longtime friendships, not the quality of the ski experience. If quality of skiing surface was my main metric, I would have moved on years ago.

 

[Harvey]

Not sure about the snowcat.

This is not snowcat skiing. It's visiting Yellowstone thermal sites and scenery in winter, a great one-day family diversion IMHO. The buffalo herds also congregate on/near the roads/thermal areas in winter.

I understood that you weren't talking about cat skiing. The cat trip is probably very cool. I was just betting that my wife would rather move around under her own power...cross country skiing, walking - that kind of stuff. She likes to minimize motorized vehicles while on vacation.

You still haven't said what your wife's top priorities for this trip are. Does she ski the same type of snow/terrain as you? What type of resort would she like? Would the upscale atmosphere of Beaver Creek attract her more than the more rustic/natural beauty of a place like Jackson? Telluride probably splits the difference here. If the resort is most important, I agree with admin that these 3 are all better than Steamboat. But Steamboat is clearly the best ski fit for you (powder, trees, intermediate to advanced intermediate pitch) and perhaps your wife too.

My wife's ideal conditions are groomers with 3 inches of powder on top. She's not a beginner but not really an intermediate either. (She needs lessons). Ideal for us would be multiple lifts that we could that we could ride together with blacks for me and blues for her. As you've note, I'd like to be offpiste as much as possible.

Part of the reason to change the topic heading. When someone wants to search/look this up in couple of years, it's going to be a lot harder to find if it's just a generic "Where to Ski."

Ok I get it now.

I'd be more prone to point you at Tuscany if you have a comp place to stay. The weather will be warmer starting in mid-March. Costs lower. You probably want to rent a cheap microscopic car at least part of the time. I've been in that part of the world recently. Lucignano in a restored 17th century farmhouse on 20 acres wouldn't suck. You're really close to Siena. Florence isn't all that far. I'd web search to find cheap flights to Rome, a cheap car at the airport in Rome for the week, and do that trip. Just beg, borrow, or steal a GPS with a European database in it before you go.

Tuscany and Siena are two of my favorite places in the world. And we have family in Milan and Rome. However my own personal bias is to get as close to the slopes as possible and stay put.

The dream would be to ski AND have a wife who felt she had an awesome 40th Bday trip. Not sure it's an achievable goal...but I can dream.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

The dream would be to ski AND have a wife who felt she had an awesome 40th Bday trip. Not sure it's an achievable goal...but I can dream.

I missed it... did you mention the possibility for comp accommodations in the Alps in addition to the North American locations included in the first post? If that's a possibility (and it'd be great to know where), as I've said a hundred times, you'll have an easier time pulling off an "all things to all people" ski vacation in the Alps rather than North America.

That said, our recent trip to New Mexico was a near perfect compromise for a couple with slightly different levels of ski mania. The mountains kept us both occupied, we had great conditions, x-c skiing everywhere, art galleries, amazing restaurants, local culture, two excellent bases of operations (Taos and Santa Fe) that aren't like so many of the McSki towns out west, fantastic accommodations, casinos (if you're into that kind of thing), all ski areas were less than 40 minutes from our hotel, etc. I know that NM isn't on your comp list; just saying that it can be done.

 

[Marc_C]

Not sure about the snowcat.

This is not snowcat skiing. It's visiting Yellowstone thermal sites and scenery in winter, a great one-day family diversion IMHO. The buffalo herds also congregate on/near the roads/thermal areas in winter.

I understood that you weren't talking about cat skiing. The cat trip is probably very cool. I was just betting that my wife would rather move around under her own power...cross country skiing, walking - that kind of stuff. She likes to minimize motorized vehicles while on vacation.

The distances involved to get to the thermal sites preclude doing it in a one-day XC ski excursion for all but the pure animals, as it would be well over 30 miles round trip.

 

[Tony Crocker]

My wife's ideal conditions are groomers with 3 inches of powder on top. She's not a beginner but not really an intermediate either. (She needs lessons). Ideal for us would be multiple lifts that we could that we could ride together with blacks for me and blues for her. As you've note, I'd like to be offpiste as much as possible.

That's a rather large gap to have any realistic expectation of riding the same lifts and returning to them (many will be long and 2,000+ vertical) at a compatible pace IMHO. In terms of terrain, this is another argument for Steamboat and Beaver Creek. Telluride has enough for both of you but you will definitely not be on the same lifts. Your wife will be able to ski maybe 10% of Jackson when she gets there. FYI Jackson has top notch (this is Adam's review from 3 days at age 10) ski instruction if you're willing to expand your budget for that.

I missed it... did you mention the possibility for comp accommodations in the Alps

Yes, you missed it; only Euro options are London, Paris, Tuscany. Just check the link Harvey44 provided.

I was just betting that my wife would rather move around under her own power...cross country skiing, walking - that kind of stuff.

If she likes cross country, Beaver Creek's looks very good. You first ride a lift up to a plateau around 10,000. So you're up high with better snow conditions and views vs. being down at a base area like most XC operations. I think it's possible to arrange to stay overnight at Old Faithful. If you did that, then you would have time to cross country ski around the thermal basin.

The dream would be to ski AND have a wife who felt she had an awesome 40th Bday trip. Not sure it's an achievable goal...but I can dream.

That depends upon how much your wife likes skiing. If she's eager to improve so you can ski more together, Jackson might work with the instruction to help make that happen. If she likes skiing but is content at her current level, Jackson is very much NOT appropriate vs. any of the 3 top Colorado options. If her dream is elsewhere, I suggest you go to Paris or Tuscany and figure out how to tack on a week in the Alps before or after.

you'll have an easier time pulling off an "all things to all people" ski vacation in the Alps rather than North America

Very true IMHO. I might add that Richard's wife doesn't ski at all, yet she went along on trips to both Kitzbuhel and St. Moritz and enjoyed both.