April Skiing - Need Some Advice

[JC]

I'm about to book our annual Spring ski trip and, due to my kids' school timetable, can only ski from April 8th-15th. We always go with another family (4 adults and 5 kids aged 11-16 in total....all pretty accomplished on the slopes). Our key criteria, honed over the years, are: availability of 4-5 BR chalets with ski-in/ski-out location, good mix of challenging (yellow on your scale) and intermediate trails, reliable snow, and a decent terrain park. We have a mix of skiers and boarders. We've had some great success in B.C. and Big Sky, but I'm a little hesitant about both areas in April due to snow conditions.

I'm thinking we should stick to areas with high elevations, north-facing slopes and reliable late-season snow. Resorts on my short-list are:

- Brighton/Solitude. Is the April snow there as good as Alta/Snowbird? I've skied great powder at Snowbird in April, but I can't find the type of accomodations I'm looking for there. Brighton does seem to have some nice chalets for rent on the slopes.

- Mammoth. This resort looks perfect, but I'm a little concerned about the difficulty of getting there, especially if flying from Canada.

- A-Basin. Great April skiing, but no slopeside accomodations and it's such a small area, I'd be worried about being bored after a couple of days.

- Thinking out of the box...how about Alyeska? Is the low elevation a problem in early- to mid-April?

Readers....any thoughts?

Thanks!

 

[Admin]

As for Brighton/Solitude, you'll find plenty of intermediate cruising at Brighton, but the heavy-duty stuff is limited to lines off the Millicent chair or in the adjacent backcountry. Either ski area is a toss-up at that time of year -- you could have powder, you could have corn, you could have slush...not unlike the Little Cottonwood resorts, albeit with ever so slightly less snowpack. Watch your closing dates, for they occur right around your desired timeframe.

As for A-Basin, you could always stay at Keystone and bus in, but that eliminates your desired ski-in/ski-out for accommodations.

 

[Tony Crocker]

The requirement you should bend is slopeside lodging, especially if cost is a factor. That said I have a great time every March with a group of 25 adults and 10 kids at the Iron Blosam at Snowbird. You don't need a 4-5 bedroom. You get a bunch of small units plus one suite and make that the dining hall and center of social activity. admin dropped in for our Sunday apres and dinner this year: he can tell you!

Mammoth does sound like a good fit for your group; it has world class terrain parks along with something-for-everyone terrain and a nearly infallible spring track record. With regard to lodging there is a limited amount truly slopeside and the price disparity is significant. Your best shot is probably in the Eagle base area, though it is at the far SE corner of the ski terrain. In addition to the new places there's an older condo complex, Summit, aross the street. The new village has gondola access to the mountain but you can't ski back to it and it's reputedly noisy at night. There are several base areas that can be accessed easily by car or free shuttle if you stay in cheaper units in town. That week is also spring break for most California public schools, but of course that's why you're stuck with that week in the first place. Mammoth can handle the crowd; I've already booked the weekend of April 8-9 myself (April 9 is my lucky powder ski day at Mammoth ).

 

[JC]

Thanks for the advice guys. Tony, the one criteria that I have no flexibility on is slopeside lodging and we don't mind paying for it. The teenage girls like to sleep in, the women like to go back to the chalet for lunch, the boys and dads like to get out for first tracks, etc. The only way for it all to work logistically (if we want to have any hope of taking some turns together) is for the home base to be on the slopes. When you divide the cost of a nice chalet between two families, we've found it to be generally cheaper than staying at a hotel for the 9 of us.

The more I hear about Mammoth, the more I like it. You can fly fairly inexpensively into Vegas and add a night there for a bit of variety. None of us have ever been there. The drive from Vegas to Mammoth might be interesting as well. Tony, what route do you recommend to the Mountain? We'll all be flying in from various points east and North.

 

[Patrick]

- Mammoth. This resort looks perfect, but I'm a little concerned about the difficulty of getting there, especially if flying from Canada.

Don't let that stop you, we are two Canadians here on FTO that went to Mammoth last year. Jonny in May and me in June.

Not sure of Jonny flights, but I did a Ottawa-Toronto-Denver-Reno trip. Left Ottawa at 10am, landed in Reno at 5:30pm, I think.

 

[Jonny D]

When i went to mammoth i saved some money driving from Toronto to buffalo then had my flight re-routed since the connecting flight was late.
My intended route was Buffalo- Minniapolis- Reno, but ended up being Buffalo - Detroit - SLC- Reno.

DON'T DO THAT.

Instead, spend the extra money, fly from wherever is closest, and if you end up in reno, get a flight that gets 4 hours before you wan to be in bed in Mammoth. Getting in a 5:30 am EST is no fun at all (other than the fact that you're on a ski vacation!).

And when you rent a car, be sure to rent something with 4 wheel drive. If you arrive in the middle of a snowstorm, the passes might not be open to 2 wheel drive vehicles, and you won't want to wait.

 

[Tony Crocker]

The drive from Vegas is longer than Reno ~5 hours, but it goes through Death Valley, which averages 89 degrees high temp in April and is an interesting contrast to Mammoth. You can get to Mammoth from L.A. or Vegas without 4WD the vast majority of the time, though you might be dependent on shuttles while you're there if weather is bad.

Now for what I know about slope-accessible lodging. Most of it is owned by Intrawest (or whoever will own Mammoth by then) and can be booked through the Mammoth website. Mammoth Mountain Inn is best location skiwise, across the street from Main Lodge. Drawbacks: 9,000 ft. is high if anyone is altitude sensitive, and its 5 miles from town for apres ski or dining alternatives. Eagle/Juniper Springs is at SE corner of ski area, 1 mile from town. The new village has the dining and apres on site, but as i said before it's noisy and you have to download the gondola or take a shuttle to get back to your room. I expect no bargains at the Intrawest properties due to the California spring break.

There are a handful of other places that are slope accessible. Summit at Eagle I mentioned before. St. Anton and 1849 across the street from Canyon Lodge. Timber Ridge up on the hill above Canyon. The Bridges where you can ski down to Eagle. There are some private homes close to Eagle also. These were the premium properties in the 1980's but might be less than the Intrawest places now. If you go through an agency and get something "walking distance to Canyon Lodge", demand to see location on a map. Canyon is at 8,400 ft., and the 3 roads coming up to it are steep.

I would suggest you start making the inquiries now, because relatively few of Mammoth's properties fit your criteria.

 

[JC]

Thank you everyone for the useful information!

We decided on Mammoth and booked a townhome with 4BR + Loft (and hot tub!) in the Bridges area near the Eagle lift from April 8-15. We reserved the lowest/closest townhome to the lift which is "supposedly" 50 yds from the ski access, although the lift is a bit out of the way. The place looks awesome and we got a 20% discount by reserving for 7 days. I found it through Mammoth Premiere Reservations, in case anyone else wants to go through the exercise I did (http://instant.dbwebs.com/default.asp is the url). They have a pretty good selection of properties. Total cost per family for 7 nights is about $2,150, which in my opinion isn't bad for a family of 5, especially since we will bring our own food and drinks and save money there.

We're flying into Vegas and looking forward to the scenic drive! We all grew up in Canada and a 5-hr drive is not a problem. We did opt for 4WD.....being stranded on a powder day is not an option. It'll be kind of weird driving through the desert into the mountains in such a short amount of time.

We're all quite excited about the trip! Mammoth has always been on my short list. Next on the agenda.....booking my flights to SLC for the "guys long weekend" in Feb! One thing's for sure....feeding this addiction ain't cheap.

Jim

 

[Admin]

Next on the agenda.....booking my flights to SLC for the "guys long weekend" in Feb!

That should be a piece of cake compared to what you just arranged. Make sure that you give me a shout prior to your arrival for some "local guiding." :wink:

 

[Tony Crocker]

You can give me a shout if you're there by April 9, though I might not be too cooperative if the conditions are like my last 3 April 9 ski days at Mammoth.

I have one piece of advice: when you start out in the morning you probably must ski down to Eagle. When you go up that lift do NOT ski through Canyon Lodge in the early to mid-mornings. Everyone staying near there plus all the skiers coming up the gondola from the new village will be in that area. Instead use Chair 9 or Chair 22 to get into the main part of the mountain. Both of these serve mainly expert terrain, but there is a groomed intermediate run off the back of 22 and intermediate runs on chair 5 are accessible from 9. If you have beginners, they should stay on Eagle until 11AM.

 

[JC]

Marc,
SLC trip is booked....arriving Thurs morning on Feb. 2 and leaving on the evening of Feb. 6. We'll be staying in a town home in Park City. We'll probably ski PC Thurs. afternoon and Monday morning. Thinking about the Bird on Friday and perhaps Solitude and Powder Mountain on the weekend. Snow conditions will likely dictate where we go. Any advice? There'll be four of us....all high school friends from Northern Ontario and up for a challenge. Would be fun to hook up for some turns. I'll give you my contact information before we leave.

Tony,
I'll give you our contact info in Mammoth before we leave. Would be great to meet up.

Jim

 

[Admin]

We'll probably ski PC Thurs. afternoon and Monday morning. Thinking about the Bird on Friday and perhaps Solitude and Powder Mountain on the weekend. Snow conditions will likely dictate where we go. Any advice?

Considering how close they are to each other, those are four incredibly different places. Forgive me if you've been here before - I don't know. But let me give you the long-winded answer just in case.

First of all, I'm assuming that you've seen these 4 feature articles that I've written here:

A Family Affair - Snowbird, Alta, Park City, Deer Valley (2004)

Subtle Changes - Alta (2002)

How Now, Pow Mow? - Powder Mountain (2001) (OK, OK, I only did the photos for that one)

Bird In the Hand - Snowbird (2002)

Now, keep in mind that although I've been coming here for years, I just actually moved here from back East in January.

That said, let me comment on a few of your choices. Given that you guys sound fairly hardcore I'm not sure that I would've stayed in PC. PCMR is decidedly intermediate overall, catering more to the same crowd that visits, say, Summit County in Colorado. The skiing is rather similar as well. It's a bit of a hoof to go from PC to the Cottonwood Canyon resorts, as you have to go all the way around. You would've been much closer to the goods -- and saved quite a bit of coin -- had you opted to stay in the Salt Lake Valley instead.

That said, PCMR does have a few good secrets, chief among them the fact that few of their visitors ski anything off the groomed trail. You'll find beautiful aspen tree stands off the King Con, Motherlode and Thaynes lifts by skiing the regions between trees. Isle of the Giants is one of the steepest sections of woods that you'll ever find -- but you won't find a sign to point the way. Just go to the top of the Jupiter lift, get off, and hang a right into the evergreens.

This year marked the first time that I ever spent a full day skiing Solitude with a local who really knew the place. (The post is here, and a streaming online video shot that day is here.) That really showed me all of the places there that I never knew existed, or didn't know how to get to -- like Black Forest, denoted by the red cross here. Just check out the convoluted topography on that map, and you'll see why local knowledge is gold at Solitude. That day in April whetted my appetite, and I'll be getting to know Solitude on a much more intimate level this coming season.

If you and your buddies have backcountry gear, and know how to use it, it's worthwhile to consider venturing into Silver Fork or Wolverine Cirque if the snow stability is right.

If you don't have the gear, I highly recommend spending a day on the Ski Utah Interconnect Adventure Tour. I went in March 2004 and, in my opinion, that's some of the best $150 ever spent in this state. Depending on where you start, you ski in and between Alta, Brighton, Solitude, and Snowbird or Deer Valley. I'd recommend the Snowbird starting point for the choice of terrain and the fact that starting in Snowbird means a loop rather than a 1-way with a van shuttle return. For your C-note and a half, you get all lift access (including line cutting privileges), two professional guides, all avalanche gear, and lunch. It's of course the backcountry between the resorts that makes the day special, and it really gives you a taste of the Wasatch. When you consider that it's about 2.5x the price of a day ticket at a resort, that's a bargain. There's minimal uphill involved, so most folks do it on ordinary alpine gear. You and your buddies would be flying home with an amazing memory. My online video shot during that day is here. Most of the skiers I filmed that day were a bunch of 20-something Brits on holiday together, and I've never seen smiles any bigger than the ones on their faces.

Is there a reason that you're leaving out Alta? Is one of your buddies a snowboarder? If not, I'd have to question your logic at not visiting Mecca. Alta also requires ample local knowledge to squeeze the most out of a day there, and I'd likely be able to help you out in that regard as that's where my season pass was last season and will in all likelihood be again this year.

I'd be as clueless as you would be at Powder Mountain. If you go, see if you can hook up with a local, for the enormous amount of terrain, useless to try to convey in two dimensions of a paper trail map, is quite confusing, especially when you throw the bus runs and Lightning Ridge into the mix. I'll be venturing back up there this season to get to know it a little bit better. Understand, too, that it's not exactly next door to where you're staying (or to SLC for that matter).

Would be fun to hook up for some turns. I'll give you my contact information before we leave.

Perfect.

 

[thesnowman]

JC you are going to love Mammoth. We have been here for the last 20 season's and I can tell you Mammoth Rocks. While other areas are closing in April we are right in the middle of it all. Great thing about April is you might have corn snow or you might just have powder.

Want to see video from last April? Click on this link http://www.mammothsnowman.com/media/sor ... ril-05.wmv and check out the video. If you are on dial up take a hike and come back. The file is 126 mb, but what you see will get you stoked for your trip!

Check out our web site at: http://www.mammothsnowman.com. We update just about daily on what is going on at Mammoth Mt..

Give us a shout when you are in town and we can get some shots of you can your gang and show you around the hill.

Snowman out...

 

[Tony Crocker]

For Mammoth videos, don't foget last May 7: http://www.adventurefilmworks.com/Videos/May7.mov

I agree with admin that you should shift your lodging from Park City to SLC. I would think this far in advance you should be able to do that without penalty.

Unlike many areas, where the advice is "avoid on weekends", Powder Mt. should specifically be visited ON a weekend day because of the bus shuttle and snowcat options that expand the terrain substantially. A visit there should be based specifically on whether there has been new snow (and no big warmup) within the 2-3 days before you arrive. If so you'll get more fresh tracks than elsewhere in Utah; if not terrain is more interesting at other areas.

 

[JC]

Marc/Tony,

First of all, thank you very much for the thorough review of the areas we are considering. We booked our place in PC because we know the owner of the property and it is the most economic option...not to mention a great place right near the town center. Also, the night life is better there than at the resorts and we didn't mind the drive into LCC last year.

I agree that PC resort is mostly intermediate, but we had a fabulous time there on the final day of our trip last year, which happened to be a powder day. We thought the trees and bowls off of the McConkey and Jupiter lifts were a lot of fun. I really liked the tree shots to the skiers right of McConkeys. We skied until the early afternoon before dashing off to catch our flight. We're skiing PC on the first and last day of the trip because they are travel days and close to the townhouse. We plan to head straight back to McConkeys and Jupiter. A couple of the people in our group were competitive freestyle skiers and the PC terrain park is first class, so we usually spend a bit of time there. I do think that this area is a bit under-rated.

We thought we'd avoid Altabird (or is it Snalta....that doesn't sound very nice does it?) on the weekend due to the crowds, particularly the Tram line at the Bird, and have always wanted to try Solitude and Powder Mountain. They seem to have decent terrain and if there is fresh snow, we thought it would get tracked out less quickly, particularly if it hasn't snowed in a while (like last year).

In terms of Alta vs. Snowbird, they are both great mountains, but I know Snowbird fairly well, as I spent a week there for one of the steeps camps. We tried Alta last year, but the snow conditions were less than ideal and none of us knew our way around the mountain. It was one of those freeze/thaw cycles with no fresh snow in a couple of weeks and we ended up heading back to the Bird and skiing corn in Mineral Basin. I'm sure we would have felt differently, had we known where to ski in Alta. We haven't made any final decisions yet, so maybe Alta will be in the picture after all. How are the crowds there on the weekend? I'd like to hit the Bird on Friday and we'll be in PC on Thursday and Monday.

We've been thinking about the Interconnect and we almost went last year. I think that's an excellent idea that we should probably do. The weekend would likely be the best time, given the backcountry routes and lift-cutting privileges.

So maybe here's the plan: PC on the travel days, the Bird on Friday, interconnect on one of the weekend days, Alta on the remaining day if there's fresh snow, Solitude/Powder Mtn if not.

We'll touch base again before the trip!

Tony, I watched the Mammoth videos from May 7th with my son (and also Jonny D's video) and everyone is pretty pumped about the vacation!

Jim

 

[Admin]

Lines at Alta were no biggie all winter -- never more than 10 minutes on the busiest Saturday, except for some peak periods on Supreme. Many times it was ski-up. The new Collins chair has really changed everything. If there has been a freeze-thaw cycle and things are crunchy, remember that Powder Mountain's elevation is significantly lower.

 

[JC]

Good point. Alta might be a great choice for the other weekend day. I'm also going to look into interconnect and maybe reserve a spot.

 

[awf170]

Lines at Alta were no biggie all winter -- never more than 10 minutes on the busiest Saturday, except for some peak periods on Supreme. Many times it was ski-up. The new Collins chair has really changed everything. If there has been a freeze-thaw cycle and things are crunchy, remember that Powder Mountain's elevation is significantly lower.

alta was absolutely packed when i was there in mid feb. Sugarloaf chair has some wicked lines. Collins also had really long lines in the morning. Im not sure how long they were, but i think they were defiantly over 10 minutes. Probably the longest lines i have ever waited in besides for a trip to sugarloaf last year.

 

[Tony Crocker]

I historically had a hard and fast rule never to set foot on Alta on a weekend or holiday after the worst lines I've ever experienced during Christmas week of 1986-87. I made an exception during the 2002 Olympics which were an unusual case. Then Marc insisted I go there with him last March 5, and I would agree that the Collins chair has relieved the situation. I would still avoid if it's a holiday weekend or a Saturday with fresh pow.

With regard to snow conditions, if there has been an extended dry spell Snowbird will hold up better than Alta due to a higher percentage of north-facing steeps. If Utah is having a lean year and coverage is low, Alta's will be the best.

 

[JC]

That's what happened with us last year at Alta. Remember the dry spell during late Jan-early Feb? We couldn't seem to find the lines at Alta. We did a lot of traversing, found some decent pitches, but they weren't very long (relative to the length of the traverse required to get there). We then headed over to the Bird....which I admittedly know a lot better....and found the goods fairly quickly. The opinion of our group was unanimous....the Bird was better under those particular conditions. That said....I'd love to spend more time at Alta with someone who knew their way around, because the terrain holds so many opportunities. Our situation was a high end problem...which outstanign resort do you spend more time at? You can't go wrong either way. In our case, a Bird in hand....well, you know the saying.