Yep, I hope you'll succeed to go there this coming october !!!! <BR> <BR>Thanks for the informations about Rime / Cascade. As I see, Cascade is quite longer, but less steep. I wonder why it's indicated double black diamond from top, on the trail map ??? I imagine the lower part is quite steeper, but for the very upper part, you can exit to reach some beginner trails, so why did they put it extreme if it's not steep ? <BR> <BR>BTW, I have a digital topographic trail map of Killington of 1969-70 (from Nelsap.org). It's funny to see the Skye Peak with only Skyelark + High Road (no Superstar in view) <BR> <BR>Anyway, here, it's really rough to take, but the coming days will all be rainy. So I'll have to go under rain or not go at all... ish... Hmmmm, the real question is more : will it be possible to bring my digital camera ! hahaha (fu** off the rain, I have some Tremblant's big plastic for rain, I won't miss the Loup-Garou for that !) I've been there last thursday, so I'm extremely eager to see how much snow is still remaining !
Just tried getting on the chat - I wasn't able to do it. <BR> <BR>I am about to start scanning pictures of my first trip to Killington May21-24, 1984. That is the year they closed on June21. No Superstar here, just Cascades (U and L) + Downdraft. Plus two from May28-29, 1985 on L Cascade.
I have one of those old rain bags from killington, <BR>or as Warren Miller calls them: Le Bag Garbage. <BR>Maybe if we all pester the people at the main swichboard at Killington in late September, they will cave in and open early. I swear that the lady at the Killington information center was sick and tired of me calling on September 30th 1992 with like a Bart Simpson: are you open yet/no, are you open yet/no.
Kevin, <BR>Look at the chart I provided after Frank's messages. There was June skiing on Cascades in the mid-80s. <BR> <BR>Frank, <BR>The upper pitch of cascades or is it Downdraft is a steep wall. I will see from the 80's pics. Lower Cascades is definately steeper than Rime, from what I can remember. The upper part of those trail was generally very bumped you.
Patrick, the chat is for next wednesday ! <BR>during winter, it's every wednesday, but during summer, it's just once a month, the first wednesday of the month. <BR>Despite, normally we can access the chat room anytime, so we could just access there even if there is nothing planned for this night <IMG SRC="http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/clipart/happy.gif" ALT="">
What I meant to say is that 1992 was the first year of skiing on Superstar (I think) in June, as 1988-1992 were transitional years of experimenting with lots of snow being made on superstar as well as less of a quantity being made on Cascade.
Hey guys, the chat room works actually. I have to reboot my computer, but I'll be there in 5-6 minutes, if you want to come in !! <BR> <BR>you just have to put a username (I use Frankontour) <BR> <BR>put a nickname (I put Contour) <BR>put your address e-mail (even don't know if it's necessary) <BR> <BR>and you sign in..... and normally it works !! <BR> <BR>back in 5 minutes there
Hey, you should take a look to the pics of Tony of Mammoth, on the western side. There is some of the best pics I've seen yet there too. The second one of Hangman's is a killer !!!! (especially for a guy that just skied in the east !) <BR> <BR><A HREF="http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/messages/16/2414.html?1054107595" TARGET="_top">http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/messages/16/2414.html?1054107595</A> <BR> <BR>don't miss that !
Ok, finally, I give up for the chat, as nobody came in, but don't forget next week !! <BR> <BR>Hey, Kevin, about your last pic of oct 31, 1992. They've blown a lot of snow on Superstar. Now, I think they just open it later, after Glades + Snowdon. Did they originally thought to open Superstar to begin the seasons ??
Good night to all, hope the pictures were some help about what early season skiing was like in the early 1990's. If I can be of further assistance please just ask and I will try to oblige. I have many fliers given out in the aerly 90's at the killington base lodge of what terrian was open for some of the thanksgiving holiday and christmas periods, if there is any interest in this stuff I can try to scan it, I also have an article of the cutting of the trails on sky peak and the installation of the Superstar Quad in 1988.
I admit I'm curious about seeing how looked like the Skye Peak, before the big trails on it, now ! <BR> <BR>This conversation begins to be a little bit long to open (even with High Speed Internet), with the 134 messages, 19 pics, 27 000 words, so I think we'll need to change of page in few days <IMG SRC="http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/clipart/sad.gif" ALT=""> but it won't be the end of the conversation !!!
Frank: <BR> <BR>In october of 1992 they decided to use a new snowmaking plan of offering skiing on Upper casade, superstar and snowshed to try to have more expanded but not inerconnected trails to cocentrate showmaking and base depths on major trails rahter than to connect it all and spread there snowmaking resources on the thin side, This arrangement sucked as you had to take the Killington truck from one mountain to the other, but managemrnt had to experminent to find what worked best for crowd controll in the early season with loads of skiers but limited terrian available.
Thanks for the explanation Kevin ! <BR>Effectively, not sure if it was a good idea cause they needed to open 3 lifts for 3 trails. It's ok if there is a big crowd, but it's generally not that, in the early season.
I have never skiied K in October, but it could get pretty crowned on weekend in early-mid November. I said this earlier, alot of tourist way of thinking is it is cold outside = let's go skiing / warm = let's do warm weather stuff, thus the crazy price and amount of people that are willing to pay for maginal condition in November... and no people after March. <BR> <BR>I finished scanning 13 pics from May 21-24, 1984 and two from May 28-29, 1985. <BR> <BR>I have tested the posting on liftline discussions. I agree with Frank, I think I will be posting theses in Liftlines because I am having more and more trouble open this discussion... 137 and counting. <BR> <BR>I also have a few very goodpics from the Cascades/Downdraft days on Victoria Day weekend (3 weekend of May), 1986 and 87. <BR> <BR>Stay tune.
Man, I had no idea that I'd touch off the 'mother of all threads' here. I guess that lamenting the end of the season, not to mention considering whether or not it really needs to be the end, really brings us outta the woodwork! I only hope that somewhere somehow some ski area management types, ASC and otherwise, read this thread and take it to heart. <BR> <BR> Really enjoy seeing all the archived pics of Kmart's extreme early and late seasons, and I may very well be in a lot of them! The Cascade pics especially bring back some memories. Someone posted pics from 10/2/92- I was there the day before for the opening and still have the T-shirt that K gave to all who came, adorned w/ autumn leaves and proudly stating "I skied Killington VT Oct 1 1992!". It was such a big deal that our local NBC TV affiliate even made the 2+ hour drive to file a story about the opening - I still reminisce about it with the ski fanatic reporter/anchor when I run across him! <BR> <BR> There were many years where myself and others watched the temperatures like a hawk and as soon as there was a 24-48 hr period with more below freezing temps than not, we just *knew*. More than once I was in a position where I just had to be at opening day but also had to be elsewhere later in the day, and it meant having to start driving to K in the wee hours before they changed the phone report to confirm they would open...and I almost always was able to make the right call. In recent years I too have occasionally badgered the poor switchboard lady, asking if they made snow during identical windows. I've felt sorry for her when she has had to lie and say "Oh no, it hasn't been cold enough" when we all now perfectly well that it had been. It was very sad when they opened the 2001/2002 season in Nov, breaking a string of at least 15 years of Oct opening, when there had been a couple of snowmaking windows during Oct. I'll hasten to add that I do, and did, give them some credit for trying something new with the first ever top-to-bottom opening this season (they could have opened less terrain earlier, but the trade off was at least a little easier to swallow IMO)! <BR> <BR> Marc's piece lamenting the removal of the K2 chair was great. Too bad they couldn't put a rope tow (are those even legal anymore?) or poma to serve upper Cascade but, as noted, the Glades chair isn't all that far away. Ironically, my fondest memory of skiing Cascade is actually from the post-K2 chair years, when I hiked up to their public relations "showcase" (their word) patch of manmade on Sept 30, 2000, thus making it all 12 calendar months that I've put skis to snow in the east (August was covered by doing Tucks w/ LftGly the previous year). Geez, you'd think they'd have let me take the skis on the gondy for all the floor-show amusement I provided for the leaf peepers, but no I had to hoof it up the old K2 line and back. We always ridiculed Sugarbush when they made just enough snow to stick a couple of employees on it for a photo op in lieu of actually opening- K was different that way until recent years. <BR> <BR> The one thing that does temper (just a little) the nostalgia for Cascade early season is the logistics of the mid-station loading on the old K2 double. Problem was, the same lift was used for everything- mt bikers, leaf peepers and skiers. The skiers had to wait at the midstation for an empty chair, which could take awhile, plus *everyone* had to download from the top at the end of their day. The lift, never a fast one to begin with, inevitably had to be slowed further for almost every peeper/biker to load and every time anyone was getting on at the top for the ride down. On busy days this meant a *lot* of lift riding/waitig time...but aw hell I'd do it again tommorrow ! <BR> <BR> I mark ski days on my calendars to keep track of the # of days I ski on my pass each year, and the latest lift-served day I've skied is 6/16/97. As noted, they were open until 6/22 that year and I even have a note that I hiked up to the Superstar headwall to ski a patch that was *still* there on July 11 (have also done Tucks in July) So yeah, all things are possible! <BR> <BR> A last note about combining the 'No Bull' reports and 'Liftlines' chat. I admit I've never checked out the 'Liftlines'. I've also on occasion written Marc to sound off about the 'No Bull' entries drifting from straight reports. My interest in this thread has tempered all that a bit, though I still do like coming to the 'No Bull' page and scrolling through a straight list of area/dates as i've come to view it as such an invaluable source of info on current conditions. It would be kinda too bad to have to extract ski reports from lots of conversational headers IMO, but maybe most will still spring from reports like this one has. It's OK, I'm good with whatever evolves.
Hey Patrick, stay in the No-bulls !! For the big conversation, don't you worry, tomorrow, we'll have a brand new conversation where to continue this discussion (hehehe). It's because many people just read the no-bulls. With a new conversation page, all will be ok for downloading the discussion. <BR> <BR>CD... yep, you're the king of this discussion. It was certainly so much nice, on early oct 1992. The mentality of the mountain looked so nice in that time !! I knew for a while that it was open so early in the past, but I'd never read comments of skiers that did it, before this week, so it's more than extremely interesting... you all should continue like that ! <IMG SRC="http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=""> <BR> <BR>About the no-bulls / liftlines. It's really simple. Actually, it's clear to see what is a ski report, with the titles. We just have to respect the (ski resort / state or province / date) and to use a completely different thing for the liftlines and it will be easy to see what is ski report and what is liftlines !
Hep, it looks like this conversation continues on this address in the liftlines ! <BR> <BR>It was too long to load the page... <BR> <BR><A HREF="http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/messages/17/2451.html?1054209762" TARGET="_top">http://www.firsttracksonline.com/discus2/messages/17/2451.html?1054209762</A> <BR> <BR>So until tomorrow I imagine, it's gonna be there I think...