Where in the west

[Admin]

Sorry, I was talking about myself. I like the snow in my backyard (December-March), I like Winter and walking in snow, but there are also others factors at play in my choice not to move. (this was also true when I couldn't ski most of the Winter because of injuries).

you hit right on the head

No offense, but frankly I think you're nuts! I love snow as much, if not more, than the next guy, but I can see it out my window 2,000 feet above the house. Snow falls here at the house with some regularity, but I hardly ever shovel the driveway as the southeast-facing concrete melts out by noon the next day. I don't miss having the half-inch of melted and refrozen ice on the driveway lasting until April - not one bit.

 

[Tony Crocker]

East vs. West depends upon where in the East vs. where in the West.

JSpin has explained quite persuasively why the Burlington area is the best in the East. And the area he lived in the West was somewhat unusual. Distances are so long in Montana that the variety of ski options within daytrip distance was quite limited.

My more pointed comments are directed to those in the East Coast metro areas, where the necessary effort to attain even a halfway decent ski lifestyle seems excessive to me. You have have to have that fanatic Patrick mentality (and ski ability) and just not care about how crappy the conditions are on many of your ski days.

 

[Patrick]

My more pointed comments are directed to those in the East Coast metro areas, where the necessary effort to attain even a halfway decent ski lifestyle seems excessive to me. You have have to have that fanatic Patrick mentality (and ski ability) and just not care about how crappy the conditions are on many of your ski days.

I would probably agree that Burlington would be the best place in the East, however I strongly resent your definition of my season and conditions that I ski on. Crappy conditions? I've said this before and will repeat again, although I'm not a fan of the local hills, I would definitely prefer living in Ottawa, Montreal or Quebec City and having access to close local ski areas that are open 4 months/year than living in Los Angeles.

Although I'm not one of the them, some great skiers are perfectly satisfied skiing and spending their entire seasons on local mole hills with the odd visit to bigger areas in the East.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

I strongly resent your definition of my season and conditions that I ski on.

"Insolence! Lowly northeastern skier, how dare you speak to me in that insubordinate tone!"

 

[Tony Crocker]

I admit to being spoiled and less addicted. The molehills and/or WROD's are worth maybe one day a month to maintain a streak by my standards.

Everyone has different priorities, both in skiing and how the skiing fits in with everything else. JSpin's priorities are very different from mine, but from his explanations I certainly understand them.

Patrick's priorities intersect more with mine, notably maximizing the variety of one's ski experiences.

Although I'm not one of the them, some great skiers are perfectly satisfied skiing and spending their entire seasons on local mole hills

Those would be the race fanatics and park rats. So I think Patrick's location makes his ski goals much more difficult.

 

[ono]

I'm with J. Spin

I've considered whitefish as a place to go for a year or two.

also SLC.

I'm a new englander, and i have to have the change of seasons. the western US does see this, but like he said- regular local (valley) snow is limited to some areas. and some folks are addicted to both skiing and snow- a dump at home and in the mountains makes the winter complete for me- i need that vibe- the piles of snow on the walkway to your door, waking to see fresh right outside- it puts me in the zone for 3 or 4 months.

living in DC for the past year and a half really makes me crave that feeling back home in new england- the blood starts pumping when you see scott braaten's snowcast.

ever hit smugg's back bowls on a midweek upslope event when few people bother to pay attention or make the pilgrimage north, or even know how much snow is falling in localized areas? something different about it- makes it special.

burlington area is a truly prime place, and the northern green mountains of vermont are something different. the best skiing anywhere for me. i'm envious of Jay's spot in outside burlington. it's within easy striking distance to smuggs, stowe, MRG, sugarbush and burlington. a great home base with a true winter.

sure, the snow is consistently better out at some western resorts. ice, bone chilling cold, and rain are regular occurrences. but a good storm, series of storms (or ever so often- a great season of many storms like last year) beats the west (and i've had great days out west). we don't expect constant, deep pure fluff. so when we get it- well, it's just that much better.

 

[Tony Crocker]

good storm, series of storms (or ever so often- a great season of many storms like last year) beats the west

The ability to take advantage of those storms is caused by proximity to the ski areas (and a flexible schedule). So for powder is it better to be half an hour from Stowe/Smuggs etc. than 5 hours from Mammoth? Absolutely. But a western skier at the same distance from as much skiing (admin or Larry Schick) is still better off IMHO.

I've said before, and Riverc0il/JSpin have demonstrated, that the powder upside in northern Vermont is comparable to western regions with similar snowfall of 250-300 inches. The problem lies in the bottom 50% of snow conditions. The farther you are from the real mountains, and/or the less flexible your schedule, the more frustrating eastern skiing is likely to be.

On these boards most of us like to project our ski fanaticism, but the reality is that our schedules are not as flexible as we might like, Riverc0il notwithstanding. So finding a better place to live may be the easiest way to upgrade the quantity and quality of one's skiing, as admin has demonstrated.

 

[Admin]

To clarify what I meant about the east coast lifestyle...my definition is the relentless pursuit of money to the exclusion of a meaningful life. It's exhausting to participate in and a real risk, in many ways.

Need a little more motivation?

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/dltJyiCuWw8&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/dltJyiCuWw8&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

 

[Harvey]

Admin,

The relevance of this clip is freaky! I always wonder how people find stuff that is so on target.

It looks beautiful, and I'd expect nothing less from a tourism promo...of course I'd need a job in there somewhere.

Thanks again for all the input.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

the east coast lifestyle...my definition is the relentless pursuit of money to the exclusion of a meaningful life. It's exhausting to participate in and a real risk, in many ways.

I'm trying to understand what that means or why it should affect you. If you let it suck you in, whose fault is that?

I'm happy that most people -- east, west, Europe, wherever -- aren't skiers, mountain bikers, hikers, or what not. It would make things pretty crowded. When I lived in Boulder, not one of my friends did anything involving the mountains. Nothing. My brother, who lives in Denver is the same way. About the closest any of them get to nature is a golf course.

 

[Admin]

When I lived in Boulder, not one of my friends did anything involving the mountains. Nothing.

That frankly surprises me. When I lived in Boulder for a few years growing up in the early 70s, everybody was into the outdoors. It was one of the pioneering hotbeds of rock climbing and mountain biking, to name but two outdoor activities. Our neighbors included both Howard Head and Mssrs. Lange and Hanson.

 

[Marc_C]

When I lived in Boulder, not one of my friends did anything involving the mountains.

Um, you had the wrong kind of friends! :wink:
Boulder is one of the largest epicenters in the country for outdoor and mountain activities. It's historic and continuing significance in American rock climbing is unquestioned. A little investigation would reveal that most outdoor magazines are based in or near Boulder.

 

[TeamSummit]

When I lived in Boulder, not one of my friends did anything involving the mountains.

Um, you had the wrong kind of friends! :wink:
Boulder is one of the largest epicenters in the country for outdoor and mountain activities. It's historic and continuing significance in American rock climbing is unquestioned. A little investigation would reveal that most outdoor magazines are based in or near Boulder.

I agree. I don't know anybody that lives in Boulder who isn't in the mountains at least once a week either skiing, snowboarding, cycling, hiking or rafting/kayaking. Frankly, my friends in Denver are the same way. It's one of the things that I love about this area.

 

[EMSC]

I'd have to concur with Admin & Marc_C. Having lived just outside Boulder for the last 10 years I find it almost surprising that it would even be possible to live here and not know some people who play in the outdoors (actually, to not know a LOT of outdoors people - Denver is a different story however). I often comment to my wife that I feel like a slacker sometimes if/when I only get out the door by 9 or 10 am to go hiking/biking, etc... as it feels/looks like the entire town has been up & out doing something for a couple hours already.

Of course living here I get to hear about all the magazines that rank Boulder (usually #1) for outdoors meccas/places to live in the US. And as mentioned all the rock climbers, pro cyclists, marathon & 10K & cross country runners, etc.. and on and on. It's got a huge skiing presence too with Spyder, Solomon, Warren Miller entertainment, ski mag, skiing mag, etc... Sometimes the magazines read like a hometown paper (once you run into/get to know the article writers and editors at various events, skiing on the hill, etc...).

But then I had/have already put my 2 cents in favoring Boulder for this thread :lol:

 

[jamesdeluxe]

I wasn't impugning Boulder's status as an outdoors hotbed, which would be a pretty silly thing to claim. My point was that Harvey's comment about the "East Coast lifestyle" revolving around the pursuit of money is similar to saying "all white people are like this" and "all black people are like that."

Just saying that there are all kinds of people everywhere... and I stand by my story that there are people who live near mountains, oceans, or whatever who don't necessarily make use of them.

 

[Harvey]

When pressed to answer what I meant about an east coast lifestyle, I came up with that response. I wasn't intending to stereotype 150 million people, but trying to provide some insight into what I was thinking about. One thing this thread has done is make me appreciate what I do have....walking to work, home for lunch, a few acres and a cabin in the adks etc.

One thing I take for granted is being able to see my daughter (18 mos) in the am, noon and at night before she goes to bed. In the business I am in, I could commute to nyc and make 50% more than I am making now, but I'd give up seeing my daughter and I'd add a lot of stress commuting etc.

Like my generalization, james captures some truth, but also overlooks certain things. My wife and daughter and I live a very simple life. An outsider looking in would probably see skiing and our ski cabin as the only non-essentials in our life. But skiing isn't a luxury to me.

What we face is that to live a very modest house, in a safe neighborhood, to save for the future and to continue to ski - I've got to make what I'm making. Living this life here really isn't so bad, but I wish it were a bit slower, where people took more time to look each other in the eye. Maybe I overstated it after having some former east coast friends visit from the Mt Ashland area - what they've got seems pretty darn good too.

Maybe I have been sucked in, maybe not. The one thing that everyone seems to have that we don't is much debt. We've got some, but it is really minimal compared to most people I see - and they think we are nuts...."you could have this or that."

Not sure if this clears anything up but it is what it is.

 

[Tony Crocker]

"East coast lifestyle" was a misleading description. "Big city" or "rat race" was what you meant, and that has little to do with geography. But the variety and quality of convenient outdoor activities will draw more like-minded people.

It sounds like you would like a metro area no more expensive than where you are (to stay within current debt limits) but want to avoid traffic and long commute times. SLC and Portland probably fit that profile best of the western cities discussed here.

It also sounds like you might be able to go completely rural, which does add Vermont to the mix. You would also have to decide if you would miss NYC for cultural attractions even though you want no part of it for work.